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jesse6520
Straight Flush
Joined: 16 Oct 2007
Posts: 367
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 Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 9:29 pm Post subject: turn a set into a bluff, nl25 |
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Full Tilt Pot-Limit Hold'em, $0.25 BB (5 handed) - Converter Tool from
UTG ($31.55)
MP ($25.80)
Hero (Button) ($34.55)
SB ($15.80)
BB ($25.00)
Preflop: Hero is Button with 5 , 5
1 fold, MP calls, Hero calls, SB calls, BB checks
Flop: ($1.00) 5 , 7, 3 (4 players)
SB checks, BB bets, 1 fold, Hero calls, 1 fold
Turn: ($2.50) 10 (2 players)
BB bets, Hero calls
River: ($6.00) A (2 players)
BB checks, Hero ??? |
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Riddim
Moderator
Joined: 04 Dec 2005
Posts: 8177
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 10:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Please don't play flop and turn like that. Raise flop and try to get it in, and once you haven't done that, raise turn. As played I guess you might fold out a few of the smallest flushes if you bet big but I'd just check back. |
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htichy78
Message Board Junkie
Joined: 17 Jun 2008
Posts: 1028
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| Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 10:42 pm Post subject: |
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| no raises at all, youve really let him draw the flush cheaply there |
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jesse6520
Straight Flush
Joined: 16 Oct 2007
Posts: 367
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| Posted: Wed Aug 27, 2008 10:51 pm Post subject: |
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| there were like 4 people in. there is no way he is betting a naked fd or tp |
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fletch_smf
Royal Flush
Joined: 06 Jun 2008
Posts: 805
Location: Brisneyland
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| Posted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 7:14 am Post subject: |
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| jesse6520 wrote: |
| there is no way he is betting a naked fd or tp |
What are you basing that on? You haven't given us any reads on the villain, so we don't know what he's likely to do? Are you saying you're sure he has you beat on the flop? Why not fold then? |
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jesse6520
Straight Flush
Joined: 16 Oct 2007
Posts: 367
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| Posted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 7:55 am Post subject: |
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| fletch_smf wrote: |
| jesse6520 wrote: |
| there is no way he is betting a naked fd or tp |
What are you basing that on? You haven't given us any reads on the villain, so we don't know what he's likely to do? Are you saying you're sure he has you beat on the flop? Why not fold then? |
no im not saying he has me beat on the flop, but i am saying that no one bets out with weak hands on these kinds of flops in 4 way pots. I feel like if i raise this im not getting called by a hand that is worse the 35% aginst but even more than that, I dont think that any worse hands are even in his range given his flop lead. He was nittier than most at nl25 fwiw. |
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st6truckie
Message Board Junkie
Joined: 28 Dec 2007
Posts: 2018
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| Posted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 8:00 am Post subject: |
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| Bet amounts would help. |
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Riddim
Moderator
Joined: 04 Dec 2005
Posts: 8177
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 10:58 am Post subject: |
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| You know, actually posting the reads you have in the OP tends to be pretty good. Still, raise the flop. Unless he's not just nittier than most but insanely nitty, he'll be betting quite a few top pairs here. He can also have every single 2 pair since he's the BB in an unraised pot. If he's not betting a good naked flush draw he probably isn't betting some weak combo draw either, so are you betting the river to fold out specifically 77 and 64? |
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jesse6520
Straight Flush
Joined: 16 Oct 2007
Posts: 367
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| Posted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 12:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Riddim wrote: |
| You know, actually posting the reads you have in the OP tends to be pretty good. Still, raise the flop. Unless he's not just nittier than most but insanely nitty, he'll be betting quite a few top pairs here. He can also have every single 2 pair since he's the BB in an unraised pot. If he's not betting a good naked flush draw he probably isn't betting some weak combo draw either, so are you betting the river to fold out specifically 77 and 64? |
are you saying that leading with the ace of hearts into 3 others is standard?
fwiw he full potted flop and turn...
there is only one two pair he can have really and on the riv id be trying to bluff out all flushes that he flopped, 64 and 77.
In other words, why would i not bet this riv? I cant think of a single hand that calls...
oh...and he was not ubernitty or anything just nittyish tag, maybe 15/10ish |
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Riddim
Moderator
Joined: 04 Dec 2005
Posts: 8177
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 3:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Yeah after thinking about it some more I'm starting to like betting river. I do think you're being really optimistic by saying you can't think of a single hand that can call though. You probably get looked up by a decent amount of high but non-nut flushes. |
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jesse6520
Straight Flush
Joined: 16 Oct 2007
Posts: 367
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| Posted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 4:34 pm Post subject: |
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| Riddim wrote: |
| Yeah after thinking about it some more I'm starting to like betting river. I do think you're being really optimistic by saying you can't think of a single hand that can call though. You probably get looked up by a decent amount of high but non-nut flushes. |
you think j or 10 high looks me up?
i think he rarely has q high
yes? |
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Riddim
Moderator
Joined: 04 Dec 2005
Posts: 8177
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 4:43 pm Post subject: |
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| I think there's a very good chance he checks river with anything but the Kh. As for the J and T looking you up, I definitely think that happens frequently enough to be significant. It's pretty easy for him to just convince himself that you wouldn't call down two big bets with the naked Kh and then call with any heart. Oh btw I just had another look at the hand and I'd raise pre for sure. |
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jesse6520
Straight Flush
Joined: 16 Oct 2007
Posts: 367
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| Posted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 4:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Riddim wrote: |
| I think there's a very good chance he checks river with anything but the Kh. As for the J and T looking you up, I definitely think that happens frequently enough to be significant. It's pretty easy for him to just convince himself that you wouldn't call down two big bets with the naked Kh and then call with any heart. Oh btw I just had another look at the hand and I'd raise pre for sure. |
yeah that is one thing im really unsure about. The thing is i feel like at nl25 people stack off with tp hands so often that it may not be worth chasing people out in pots like this where there are already so many people in the pot. I mean yes you will win pots more often that way. But when you flop a set you will prob not win a big one. If you dont raise pre though there is a very good chance youll win a big pot if you flop a set. |
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Riddim
Moderator
Joined: 04 Dec 2005
Posts: 8177
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 4:56 pm Post subject: |
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| Well, if someone hits it's actually going to be way easier to stack them in a raised pot than in an unraised one. It's also going to be much easier to win the pot without flopping a set when you raise pre. I wouldn't call one limper "so many people" either. |
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jesse6520
Straight Flush
Joined: 16 Oct 2007
Posts: 367
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| Posted: Thu Aug 28, 2008 4:57 pm Post subject: |
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| Riddim wrote: |
| Well, if someone hits it's actually going to be way easier to stack them in a raised pot than in an unraised one. It's also going to be much easier to win the pot without flopping a set when you raise pre. I wouldn't call one limper "so many people" either. |
if there was only one limper then i agree i played it badly. If there were two limpers do you still maintain raising? what about three? |
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