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dodge these
Message Board Junkie
Joined: 21 Jun 2006
Posts: 1052
Location: undisclosed
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 Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 2:11 pm Post subject: Proof that it's Rigged! |
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This was posted by someone else in the omaha section, but I think it belongs here for anyone that still insists the game isn't obviously rigged:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ct4S-5NlxAQ |
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donotraisemebro
Pair
Joined: 26 Jul 2008
Posts: 40
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| Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 2:19 pm Post subject: |
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reasons why full tilt is rigged
Full Tilt Poker Game #11750137877: Table Ewer (deep 6) - $0.05/$0.10 - No Limit Hold'em - 14:09:14 ET - 2009/04/18
ellocko 29 posts the small blind of $0.05
Kacang posts the big blind of $0.10
The button is in seat #3
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to DoNotRaiseMeBro [3s 3c]
2srwylde folds
DoNotRaiseMeBro has 15 seconds left to act
DoNotRaiseMeBro raises to $0.35
Kazuooo folds
InaDeQuAte folds
ellocko 29 calls $0.30
Kacang calls $0.25
*** FLOP *** [7d 3h 6s]
ellocko 29 bets $18.80
Kacang: good move
Kacang has 15 seconds left to act
Kacang folds
DoNotRaiseMeBro calls $10.30, and is all in
ellocko 29 shows [9s 6h]
DoNotRaiseMeBro shows [3s 3c]
Uncalled bet of $8.50 returned to ellocko 29
*** TURN *** [7d 3h 6s] [5h]
*** RIVER *** [7d 3h 6s 5h] [8d]
Kacang: L O L
ellocko 29 shows a straight, Nine high
DoNotRaiseMeBro shows three of a kind, Threes
ellocko 29 wins the pot ($20.21) with a straight, Nine high
DoNotRaiseMeBro adds $10
Full Tilt Poker Game #11750121115: Table Crop (deep 6) - $0.05/$0.10 - No Limit Hold'em - 14:08:01 ET - 2009/04/18
Seat 1: Mr Fortress ($19.24)
Seat 2: iamfs ($10)
Seat 3: richxxx85 ($10.05)
Seat 4: Yuros2000 ($35.63)
Seat 5: DoNotRaiseMeBro ($10)
Seat 6: dviking60 ($18.29)
richxxx85 posts the small blind of $0.05
Yuros2000 posts the big blind of $0.10
The button is in seat #2
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to DoNotRaiseMeBro [Kh Kc]
DoNotRaiseMeBro raises to $0.35
dviking60 folds
Mr Fortress has 15 seconds left to act
Mr Fortress folds
iamfs folds
richxxx85 folds
Yuros2000 raises to $0.80
DoNotRaiseMeBro raises to $10, and is all in
Yuros2000 calls $9.20
DoNotRaiseMeBro shows [Kh Kc]
Yuros2000 shows [9h 9d]
*** FLOP *** [9s 4s Th]
*** TURN *** [9s 4s Th] [Jh]
*** RIVER *** [9s 4s Th Jh] [6c]
DoNotRaiseMeBro shows a pair of Kings
Yuros2000 shows three of a kind, Nines
Yuros2000 wins the pot ($18.72) with three of a kind, Nines
DoNotRaiseMeBro adds $10
Full Tilt Poker Game #11750105920: Table Crop (deep 6) - $0.05/$0.10 - No Limit Hold'em - 14:06:54 ET - 2009/04/18
Seat 1: Mr Fortress ($19.29)
Seat 2: iamfs ($10)
Seat 3: richxxx85 ($10)
Seat 4: Yuros2000 ($26.82)
Seat 5: DoNotRaiseMeBro ($10)
Seat 6: dviking60 ($18.29)
Mr Fortress posts the small blind of $0.05
iamfs posts the big blind of $0.10
The button is in seat #6
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to DoNotRaiseMeBro [Jh Js]
richxxx85 folds
Yuros2000 raises to $0.30
DoNotRaiseMeBro raises to $1.20
dviking60 folds
Mr Fortress folds
iamfs adds $0.10
iamfs folds
Yuros2000 calls $0.90
*** FLOP *** [9s Qs Jc]
Yuros2000 checks
DoNotRaiseMeBro bets $1.95
Yuros2000 raises to $12
DoNotRaiseMeBro calls $6.85, and is all in
Yuros2000 shows [Td Ts]
DoNotRaiseMeBro shows [Jh Js]
Uncalled bet of $3.20 returned to Yuros2000
*** TURN *** [9s Qs Jc] [As]
*** RIVER *** [9s Qs Jc As] [8h]
Yuros2000 shows a straight, Queen high
DoNotRaiseMeBro shows three of a kind, Jacks
Yuros2000 wins the pot ($18.81) with a straight, Queen high |
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jeremysuave
Full House
Joined: 02 Apr 2008
Posts: 178
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| Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 2:32 pm Post subject: |
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I think you made a mistake. You said you were gonna show us proof that this site is rigged but you accidentally just showed us three bad beats.
You shouldn't confuse the two. |
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donotraisemebro
Pair
Joined: 26 Jul 2008
Posts: 40
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| Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 2:35 pm Post subject: |
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| 3 badbeats *in 4 minutes*. i also had 3 more, excluding these, in the two hours sessions, 80%/20% (or better) hands. |
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jeremysuave
Full House
Joined: 02 Apr 2008
Posts: 178
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| Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 2:55 pm Post subject: |
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I didn't say that it doesn't suck, I'm just saying that these bad beats happen to everybody.
And I can tell that your still tilting because I have seen these same hh's on three different threads.
Take a deep breath. |
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Kam1972
Message Board Junkie
Joined: 03 Sep 2008
Posts: 2181
Location: Lady Luck's house asking nicely for favouritism.
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| Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 3:10 pm Post subject: |
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| donotraisemebro wrote: |
| 3 badbeats *in 4 minutes*. i also had 3 more, excluding these, in the two hours sessions, 80%/20% (or better) hands. |
Still isn't proof its rigged mate, just that you ran against the averages. Those hands against you are going to win 1 out of 5 times on the odds, but much like flipping a coin there is no certainty that you aren't going to get it come up heads 10 times in a row.
You really can't call something on a small section of hands of poker, its plain crazy in a game such as this. You have to look at the game over thousands of hands and then look at the statistics. While its a game of skill there is also luck, and sometimes thats going to run against you, and sometimes in long streaks... ask any pro, that happens to them online and live. |
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Camby24
Message Board Junkie
Joined: 01 Mar 2008
Posts: 2962
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| Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 3:20 pm Post subject: |
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| did you highlight the time to show us you have the ability to time travel backwards??? |
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paul_mcc1099
The Flying Scotsman
Joined: 10 Jan 2008
Posts: 1729
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland
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| Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 3:39 pm Post subject: |
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| thats is so sick, kinda like my luck |
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Blackray
Royal Flush
Joined: 20 Mar 2008
Posts: 856
Location: Bergen, Norway
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| Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 3:46 pm Post subject: Re: Proof that it's Rigged! |
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haha I'd love to hear Gnomebank's take on this  |
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Kam1972
Message Board Junkie
Joined: 03 Sep 2008
Posts: 2181
Location: Lady Luck's house asking nicely for favouritism.
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| Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 3:55 pm Post subject: Re: Proof that it's Rigged! |
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| Blackray wrote: |
haha I'd love to hear Gnomebank's take on this |
Well his view is obvious... this type of thing ONLY happens online, and never happens live, so clearly they used Fulltilts RNG for the cards in this game... it can be the only possible answer. That or they did it for TV ratings and it was a fix too.
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UFO1947
Take me2 ur Chip Leader
Joined: 08 Jun 2006
Posts: 5520
Location: NS, Canada
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| Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 4:12 pm Post subject: |
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| live poker is rigged |
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IABoomer
Moderator
Joined: 29 Oct 2006
Posts: 8190
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| Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 5:13 pm Post subject: Re: Proof that it's Rigged! |
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| Kam1972 wrote: |
| Blackray wrote: |
haha I'd love to hear Gnomebank's take on this |
Well his view is obvious... this type of thing ONLY happens online, and never happens live, so clearly they used Fulltilts RNG for the cards in this game... it can be the only possible answer. That or they did it for TV ratings and it was a fix too.
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Sorry, but wrong. The casino where the game was played is a business, and since the main point of business is making the most money possible, greed corrupts any business.
The casino stacked the deck, rigging the hand for action, and making sure that PA would lose all four hands despite being about a 3:1 favorite. The free advertising via viral video gets them additional publicity with no additional cost. |
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SmellsLikeDonk
Royal Flush
Joined: 12 Jan 2009
Posts: 599
Location: Shoving where it's +EV
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| Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 5:35 pm Post subject: Re: Proof that it's Rigged! |
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| IABoomer wrote: |
| Kam1972 wrote: |
| Blackray wrote: |
haha I'd love to hear Gnomebank's take on this |
Well his view is obvious... this type of thing ONLY happens online, and never happens live, so clearly they used Fulltilts RNG for the cards in this game... it can be the only possible answer. That or they did it for TV ratings and it was a fix too.
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Sorry, but wrong. The casino where the game was played is a business, and since the main point of business is making the most money possible, greed corrupts any business.
The casino stacked the deck, rigging the hand for action, and making sure that PA would lose all four hands despite being about a 3:1 favorite. The free advertising via viral video gets them additional publicity with no additional cost. |
What casino was that again? |
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Driv3Thru
Four of a Kind
Joined: 26 Nov 2008
Posts: 272
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| Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 5:37 pm Post subject: |
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| donotraisemebro wrote: |
reasons why full tilt is rigged
Full Tilt Poker Game #11750137877: Table Ewer (deep 6) - $0.05/$0.10 - No Limit Hold'em - 14:09:14 ET - 2009/04/18
ellocko 29 posts the small blind of $0.05
Kacang posts the big blind of $0.10
The button is in seat #3
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to DoNotRaiseMeBro [3s 3c]
2srwylde folds
DoNotRaiseMeBro has 15 seconds left to act
DoNotRaiseMeBro raises to $0.35
Kazuooo folds
InaDeQuAte folds
ellocko 29 calls $0.30
Kacang calls $0.25
*** FLOP *** [7d 3h 6s]
ellocko 29 bets $18.80
Kacang: good move
Kacang has 15 seconds left to act
Kacang folds
DoNotRaiseMeBro calls $10.30, and is all in
ellocko 29 shows [9s 6h]
DoNotRaiseMeBro shows [3s 3c]
Uncalled bet of $8.50 returned to ellocko 29
*** TURN *** [7d 3h 6s] [5h]
*** RIVER *** [7d 3h 6s 5h] [8d]
Kacang: L O L
ellocko 29 shows a straight, Nine high
DoNotRaiseMeBro shows three of a kind, Threes
ellocko 29 wins the pot ($20.21) with a straight, Nine high
DoNotRaiseMeBro adds $10
Full Tilt Poker Game #11750121115: Table Crop (deep 6) - $0.05/$0.10 - No Limit Hold'em - 14:08:01 ET - 2009/04/18
Seat 1: Mr Fortress ($19.24)
Seat 2: iamfs ($10)
Seat 3: richxxx85 ($10.05)
Seat 4: Yuros2000 ($35.63)
Seat 5: DoNotRaiseMeBro ($10)
Seat 6: dviking60 ($18.29)
richxxx85 posts the small blind of $0.05
Yuros2000 posts the big blind of $0.10
The button is in seat #2
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to DoNotRaiseMeBro [Kh Kc]
DoNotRaiseMeBro raises to $0.35
dviking60 folds
Mr Fortress has 15 seconds left to act
Mr Fortress folds
iamfs folds
richxxx85 folds
Yuros2000 raises to $0.80
DoNotRaiseMeBro raises to $10, and is all in
Yuros2000 calls $9.20
DoNotRaiseMeBro shows [Kh Kc]
Yuros2000 shows [9h 9d]
*** FLOP *** [9s 4s Th]
*** TURN *** [9s 4s Th] [Jh]
*** RIVER *** [9s 4s Th Jh] [6c]
DoNotRaiseMeBro shows a pair of Kings
Yuros2000 shows three of a kind, Nines
Yuros2000 wins the pot ($18.72) with three of a kind, Nines
DoNotRaiseMeBro adds $10
Full Tilt Poker Game #11750105920: Table Crop (deep 6) - $0.05/$0.10 - No Limit Hold'em - 14:06:54 ET - 2009/04/18
Seat 1: Mr Fortress ($19.29)
Seat 2: iamfs ($10)
Seat 3: richxxx85 ($10)
Seat 4: Yuros2000 ($26.82)
Seat 5: DoNotRaiseMeBro ($10)
Seat 6: dviking60 ($18.29)
Mr Fortress posts the small blind of $0.05
iamfs posts the big blind of $0.10
The button is in seat #6
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to DoNotRaiseMeBro [Jh Js]
richxxx85 folds
Yuros2000 raises to $0.30
DoNotRaiseMeBro raises to $1.20
dviking60 folds
Mr Fortress folds
iamfs adds $0.10
iamfs folds
Yuros2000 calls $0.90
*** FLOP *** [9s Qs Jc]
Yuros2000 checks
DoNotRaiseMeBro bets $1.95
Yuros2000 raises to $12
DoNotRaiseMeBro calls $6.85, and is all in
Yuros2000 shows [Td Ts]
DoNotRaiseMeBro shows [Jh Js]
Uncalled bet of $3.20 returned to Yuros2000
*** TURN *** [9s Qs Jc] [As]
*** RIVER *** [9s Qs Jc As] [8h]
Yuros2000 shows a straight, Queen high
DoNotRaiseMeBro shows three of a kind, Jacks
Yuros2000 wins the pot ($18.81) with a straight, Queen high |
Wow. This was so stupid. Why did you even bet so much when you hit your set?
Second, KK overthrown by 99. TERRIBLE. Worst beat ever. |
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TheGnomeBank
Banned
Joined: 30 Sep 2008
Posts: 964
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| Posted: Sat Apr 18, 2009 8:21 pm Post subject: Re: Proof that it's Rigged! |
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| Blackray wrote: |
haha I'd love to hear Gnomebank's take on this |
Well my take is partially along the lines of our resident Bi Romeo (aka IABoomer ) but is actually in 2 parts.
1st - Yes obviously any casino can rig a deck of cards and I'm sure some do. Cheating exists in all forms of gambling. Now would a casino do it during a high profile televised event? Some would say No, they wouldn't take that risk. But then we have plenty of historical instances where sport / match fixing has been uncovered involving players and hosting bodies.
Above all else you have to remember that it's TV. TV is about 1 thing, entertainment. Boring standard cards do not make entertainment. There's plenty of incentive for the house AND the players to stage his whole thing. Just think big.
2nd - Even if we accept that this televised statistical anomaly was a genuine freak in variance, what we can not get away from is the fact that, online, the frequency of such crazy outcomes is undeniably far higher than in these television live games. And this is not down to simple volume of hands played. I can play probably 2-3 SnGs in the space of 1-2 hours and I can guarantee we will see numerous instances where silly outcomes occur.
2 days ago I entered a large $10+$1 MTT on Stars. Within the first 30 hands I had a player drawn all-in 3 times. Mysteriously it was always the same player I was up against.
Hand 1: I have KsKc he has KdQd. I'm 86% to 14% to win. He makes a flush.
Hand 2: I have AhJd he has KhJc. I'm about 75% vs 25% to win and still lose.
Hand 3. I have Qs8s vs KcJc. The flop is 3cQc3h which is where the money goes in. I'm 55% vs 45% to win and opp makes his flush.
Hand 4. I have 7d4d (BB) vs 4s3s. Flop is 8h5dKs. I'm 77% vs 23% to win but the pot splits.
The hand that finally bust me out:
I had A6 and a board of 6 A K. My 2 pair look good so I shove, and get called by AQ. The board then proceeds to go 6 A K T K. The rivered K nullifies my pair of 6s and opp makes his own magical 2 pair from nothing.
No, I'm sorry but in my mind, (and in all our HHs) it's clear that statistically winning hands are losing more frequently online than we ever see in televised live games. It's not about volume of hands played. It's about instances per 100 hands played. |
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