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irishs2k
Full House
Joined: 19 Feb 2006
Posts: 158
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 Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 2:52 am Post subject: Wow...Where do these donks come from. |
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So i work my way up on tokens and play a tier 3 $69+6....Look how i get knocked out...
Full Tilt Poker Game #747247031: Tier Three $69+$6 Sit & Go (4942672), Table 1 - 30/60 - No Limit Hold'em - 3:36:40 ET - 2006/06/27
Seat 1: karma1 (1,237)
Seat 2: rafrbo (1,490)
Seat 4: SteamRaise (1,725)
Seat 5: Astoria Warrior (3,288)
Seat 6: IRISHs2K (1,250)
Seat 7: daisy-may wins (2,220)
Seat 8: wezbad1 (540)
Seat 9: RoadKing_er (1,750)
Astoria Warrior posts the small blind of 30
IRISHs2K posts the big blind of 60
The button is in seat #4
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to IRISHs2K [Kd Tc]
daisy-may wins folds
wezbad1 folds
RoadKing_er folds
karma1 folds
rafrbo raises to 120
SteamRaise folds
Astoria Warrior folds
IRISHs2K calls 60
*** FLOP *** [8c 6s Ts]
IRISHs2K checks
rafrbo bets 180
IRISHs2K raises to 400
rafrbo raises to 1,370, and is all in
IRISHs2K calls 730, and is all in
rafrbo shows [Qc 6c]
IRISHs2K shows [Kd Tc]
Uncalled bet of 240 returned to rafrbo
*** TURN *** [8c 6s Ts] [3h]
*** RIVER *** [8c 6s Ts 3h] [Qs]
rafrbo shows two pair, Queens and Sixes
IRISHs2K shows a pair of Tens
rafrbo wins the pot (2,530) with two pair, Queens and Sixes
IRISHs2K: wtf
IRISHs2K stands up
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 2,530 | Rake 0
Board: [8c 6s Ts 3h Qs]
Seat 1: karma1 didn't bet (folded)
Seat 2: rafrbo showed [Qc 6c] and won (2,530) with two pair, Queens and Sixes
Seat 4: SteamRaise (button) didn't bet (folded)
Seat 5: Astoria Warrior (small blind) folded before the Flop
Seat 6: IRISHs2K (big blind) showed [Kd Tc] and lost with a pair of Tens
Seat 7: daisy-may wins didn't bet (folded)
Seat 8: wezbad1 didn't bet (folded)
Seat 9: RoadKing_er didn't bet (folded)
Not exactly a "bad beat"....but my god...such horrible play for the buy in amount for a sit and go. Was this idiot just trying to lose? I mean wtf, how can he not sense i have the better hand...If i was beat legit by well played poker no problem, but donk bs like this is just too much for me to handle...wow.   |
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mathman1115
Wizard of Odderation
Joined: 01 Sep 2005
Posts: 3085
Location: Land of the Fightin' Phillies
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| Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 9:47 pm Post subject: |
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this is why i don't care much for the "tiers" (i will use my 26 tokens for the guarantees).
In a tier, you need to survive 3 tournaments to cash in. YOu know that somewhere along the way someone is going to get a brain cramp and you will get screwed. You need your hands to hold up for 3 tournaments before you cash in, which, even if you are all in with the best hand everytime, is hard to do. It's alot of survival, although i guess its not really much different when playing a tourney with 500 people lol. Its like anything else, its poker i guess. |
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nevernuts
High Card
Joined: 22 Jun 2006
Posts: 8
Location: cheektowaga NY
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| Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 11:08 pm Post subject: FULL OF DONKS |
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| this whole site has gone to the donkfish its really getting frustrating to keep losing to these people who think it is cute to play garbage cards and beat a dominating hand, and then they think that they did the right thing t.v is bringing on to many donks because they see the ppl on there bust out the real pros and they think it is cute. |
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DC11GE
Message Board Junkie
Joined: 03 Mar 2006
Posts: 2954
Location: Hollywood, CA
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| Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 11:19 pm Post subject: |
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These donks pay my rent. Bring 'em on  |
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GuitarDean
Full House
Joined: 02 May 2006
Posts: 169
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Tue Jun 27, 2006 11:36 pm Post subject: Re: Wow...Where do these donks come from. |
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| irishs2k wrote: |
| Not exactly a "bad beat"....but my god...such horrible play for the buy in amount for a sit and go. Was this idiot just trying to lose? I mean wtf, how can he not sense i have the better hand...If i was beat legit by well played poker no problem, but donk bs like this is just too much for me to handle...wow. |
Well calling an all-in re-raise with just top pair is pretty gutsy.
Chances are he thought that with that board, you probably don't have more than 1 pair, so you may throw away your hand if faced with an all-in bet. Or he may have been hoping that you'd be scared of a slowplayed monster because of his min-raise. Or perhaps he tagged you (correctly or incorrectly) that you're playing on scared money, so he thought he could bully you out of a pot with an all-in reraise; it could've been just a bad read that wound up getting luck, who knows?
From the HH itself I don't agree with what he did; but on the other hand I don't agree with you saying "wtf, is he just trying to lose?!" either.
It was indeed very unlucky for you to lose the hand, but I'm just saying don't be too quick to call all lucky drawouts donkey moves.
Not targetting you specifically, but does anyone else agree that HH just don't show enough information? Of course sometimes you can obviously pick out a donkey move, but HHs show nothing about table image or the tendencies of a player, and in certain situations those are more important than the cards themselves. Just something to think about next time you read a HH - they tell only part of the story, especially at the $75 buy-in tourneys. |
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irishs2k
Full House
Joined: 19 Feb 2006
Posts: 158
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| Posted: Wed Jun 28, 2006 4:17 am Post subject: Re: Wow...Where do these donks come from. |
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| GuitarDean wrote: |
| irishs2k wrote: |
| Not exactly a "bad beat"....but my god...such horrible play for the buy in amount for a sit and go. Was this idiot just trying to lose? I mean wtf, how can he not sense i have the better hand...If i was beat legit by well played poker no problem, but donk bs like this is just too much for me to handle...wow. |
Well calling an all-in re-raise with just top pair is pretty gutsy.
Chances are he thought that with that board, you probably don't have more than 1 pair, so you may throw away your hand if faced with an all-in bet. Or he may have been hoping that you'd be scared of a slowplayed monster because of his min-raise. Or perhaps he tagged you (correctly or incorrectly) that you're playing on scared money, so he thought he could bully you out of a pot with an all-in reraise; it could've been just a bad read that wound up getting luck, who knows?
From the HH itself I don't agree with what he did; but on the other hand I don't agree with you saying "wtf, is he just trying to lose?!" either.
It was indeed very unlucky for you to lose the hand, but I'm just saying don't be too quick to call all lucky drawouts donkey moves.
Not targetting you specifically, but does anyone else agree that HH just don't show enough information? Of course sometimes you can obviously pick out a donkey move, but HHs show nothing about table image or the tendencies of a player, and in certain situations those are more important than the cards themselves. Just something to think about next time you read a HH - they tell only part of the story, especially at the $75 buy-in tourneys. |
Dude, his play was horrible...if he's that reckless with his chips on second pair, after getting reraised... (Obviously I’m trapping with a good hand)...with risking getting knocked out, then that is donk play. IMO that is idiotic play, but hey I'm not a loose aggressive maniac either. I possibly understand a call after my reraise, which would of brought a turn, which was 3h....now if he would of just called my reraise, he would be roughly %37 to win the hand at this point with me having atleast top pair or possibly better, in which he'd have to fold if he any sense... (I bring that up cause what is he hoping to catch if I call his reraise, which I most likely would do because I reraised his bet on the flop? Q or 6 with two cards to come...ok buddy) Calling my reraise after the flop is the only thing he should have done, besides folding. I showed the aggression, and he didn’t even pick up that his second par was dominated....The only thing I was scared of was A10, or possibly a set since he raised preflop...or possibly 2 overs on a flush draw, but doubted that....I felt my hand was the best and I never really second guess my gut instinct....most the time I know when I’m beat...And like I said if I get beat by well played poker, I have no problem with it...It really gets to me when horrible play is rewarded. I hate to see it happen to others at the table as well.
On a second note, I really do like the fact that there are donks out there that will basically give you charity chips by having faith with their whole stack on second pair, or other garbage like that. I was feeling great after seeing his cards flip, but yeah not so great after the river....I do get alot of chips from players like this all the time. It's was just such a disappointment to get knocked out by horrible play on the river, out of a step 3 tourney, after grinding the previous 2 for nothing. If I was knocked out on say a coin flip, or my opponent having decent odds against me I'd accept my beat with no complaint...donk play which results in a suck out on the river, and you'll see me posting in the bad beat forum...Oh well, as many people say, "That’s Poker."
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bonzodrums0
Straight Flush
Joined: 14 Mar 2006
Posts: 394
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| Posted: Wed Jun 28, 2006 11:54 am Post subject: |
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| I have to agree with guitar dean here. Unless you had a great read on your opponent, CALLING an all-in re raise with top pair is a pretty donkish play. There is a strong possibility that he had a set considering the way he played it. It still was a bad beat, but i think you could have saved you're chips for a better opprotunity. |
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Riddim
Moderator
Joined: 04 Dec 2005
Posts: 8177
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Wed Jun 28, 2006 12:29 pm Post subject: |
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| How can you guys neglect to mention the pretty obvious risk of being up against an overpair? K-T really sucks in this spot unless you have a good read on your opponent. |
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dumwaldo
Message Board Junkie
Joined: 23 May 2006
Posts: 1656
Location: look to the stars
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2006 11:36 am Post subject: Re: Wow...Where do these donks come from. |
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| irishs2k wrote: |
| Not exactly a "bad beat"....but my god...such horrible play for the buy in amount for a sit and go. Was this idiot just trying to lose? I mean wtf, how can he not sense i have the better hand...If i was beat legit by well played poker no problem, but donk bs like this is just too much for me to handle...wow. |
This really sums up a lot. There are 2 things that I think many people on this forum neglect to consider.
The first thing is to consider the other players perspective. This guy made a risky play but I wouldn't call it outright bad poker. He made a very strong semi bluff and got called down. In your position a great many players would have folded and the move would have worked. You seem to have not even considered the possibility you would be facing a set of 6's or 8's since he did bet out pre-flop.
Personally, if it were me, I think I might have folded in your position. When i play a K, 10 I am looking the straight or to pair up the king and use the 10 as a kicker. When the 10 pairs, I have little confidence in the hand. With 2 cards to come there are infinate possibilities for someone to pair up any face card and crush the 10's. Playing the 10 pair with the king kicker is settling for what you get rather than getting what you have been waiting for. Sure the 10's are good to pick up a small pot but once someone goes all in the hand would be over for me.
The other thing I think fails to get proper consideration here is the stakes. For you a $70 game is an expensive buy in but to a $50/$100 NL player it is not even one big blind. I am a low limit player. I play $1/$2 and $2/$4 level games for the most part. If you run into me on a 5¢/10¢ table chances are it is going to end with someone calling me a donkey. I only go to these micro limit tables to work out frustrations when the cards are hitting me like bricks. It is nothing to me to go to a micro table, buy in for $10 and bet it all in pre-flop on the first hand, but for some people theri $10 buy in is a substantial piece of their bankroll. To me I just go to a 2/4 and steal 2 sets of blinds and I am ahead by $2.
Think about it this way. The guy was supposed to win 1 out of 3 times and you were supposed to win it 2 out of 3 times. Since you played and lost your one time the next 2 times you find yourself in this situation you are supposed to win. As a consulation the next 2 times the other guy finds himself in this situation he is supposed to lose it. It is a karma like concept and you don't get to be rewarded off that player but somewhere down the road you will find yourself catching that same break that you lost out on this time.
good luck on the felt,
dumwaldo |
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AcesHigh32
Flush
Joined: 22 Feb 2006
Posts: 143
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| Posted: Sat Jul 01, 2006 8:05 pm Post subject: |
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| I like the way you left the table. You think you're Hellmuth or something? |
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stevn
Message Board Junkie
Joined: 19 Feb 2006
Posts: 1117
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| Posted: Sun Jul 02, 2006 11:13 pm Post subject: |
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| actually i really don't like playing king ten in the first place. especially calling a raise with it out of posistion... but it was out of the big blind so it is reasonable because he could have been stealing and it was a weak raise. then he bets out on the flop representing strength. i might have smooth called with the tens but raising is a good play to get some more info. he could be making a continuation bet, but when he goes all in i'm mucking like THAT. i mean the best posistion you could be in really is that he has a flush draw. he could have a set, ace ten, or an overpair. unless you've got a great read on how he has been playing then i can't put him on anything less than an over pair. i really don't like the call you made. i think you could just save your chips for a better spot. turns out that you did make a great call and got a little bit unlucky but you kind of got lucky that he didn't have a monster. other than the call i think you played the hand fairly well. that is just my opinion though. |
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irishs2k
Full House
Joined: 19 Feb 2006
Posts: 158
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| Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2006 4:58 pm Post subject: |
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i also did forget to mention that i noticed while playing this tourny, that rafrbo was very loose and played/raised with garbage hands. As you can see from the suckout he made on me he stayed true to his game. Atleast in this sit and go. All it comes down to, is that i had an excellent read on this guy, i choose to make the call due to watching his play earlier and having the gut feeling i had the best hand. My poker instincts are rarely off, i tend to know when i'm beat. I wonder if all these people would still be calling my play "bad" if his 5 outer with two cards to come didn't hit.
I just think its funny that all you people dog me for my play when this loose maniac goes all in with second pair for all his chips, (after i checked to boot, he bets, and i check raise to show this moron i was slow playing the best hand.) I knew i had best hand, i contemplated all of the possibiltys and just knew i was infront, call it poker insticts if you will. Take a look at this link...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LEfLXr3eSxs&search=phil%20ivey
Sometimes you just know your best... Don't criticize me for making the right call, theres always gonna be possibilites of someone having a better hand unless you flop the absolute nuts. My gut told me i was ahead and it was obvioulsy right, i call it just another case of, "poorly played poker rewarded." But i guess thats just me. |
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irishs2k
Full House
Joined: 19 Feb 2006
Posts: 158
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| Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 2:12 am Post subject: |
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| AcesHigh32 wrote: |
| I like the way you left the table. You think you're Hellmuth or something? |
Well i wrote WTF cause i couldn't believe what he had and sucked out / won with...If you get beat by horrible play its gonna piss you off. |
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arsenal11
Pair
Joined: 30 Aug 2005
Posts: 30
Location: hell
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| Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 10:37 pm Post subject: |
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| WHOEVER POSTED THIS IS AN IDIOT AK IS A HUGE FAVORITE AGAINST AQ YOU ALL DONT KNOW WHAT YOUR TALKING ABOUT |
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Big Slick x13x
Forum Icon
Joined: 18 Jun 2006
Posts: 4324
Location: ROK
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| Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2006 10:47 pm Post subject: |
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| irishs2k wrote: |
| AcesHigh32 wrote: |
| I like the way you left the table. You think you're Hellmuth or something? |
Well i wrote WTF cause i couldn't believe what he had and sucked out / won with...If you get beat by horrible play its gonna piss you off. |
I actually think you made a terrible play CALLING all in with just a pair. From the HH it looks like this person is just bluffing the whole way. They probably just said this hand, no matter what, I'm playing it like AA. With someone who has less chips in the hand with them it only made it easier. I don't agree to raising all in with bottom pair, but if they thought that's the only way to win the pot I could understand the play. They were probably not happy that you called the bet, even before turning your cards over. |
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