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Mikelib · Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 6:46 am Post subject: Early in a tournament play

Hi, How much attentention do you pay to the table early on in an online tournament? I play a very tight game early on, so to kill the boredom I tend to surf the internet and check my emails ect.Does anyone else do the same or do you all focus 100% on the game in play?

Zophar · Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 7:05 am Post subject:

I like to pay attention early on, moreso in MTT's. My goal in MTT's is to accumulate chips early, so I actually will try to get in w/more drawing hands etc. Primarily playing position is a key and seeing flops for cheap. In S&G's, I play much tighter early on, but I do like to pay attention so I know how each opponent plays once the blinds increase.

Zherohour · Two Pair Joined: 25 May 2006 Posts: 74 Location: Cleveland

well if everyone is playing tight you can loosen up a bit and steal some blinds. Wont know how tight it is unless you're watching.

Zophar · Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 7:20 am Post subject:

My only disagreement with that is regarding stealing blinds. In the 1st 3-5 levels, the risk/reward isn't so good because of the blind size. My primary goal is to double or triple up within those 1st couple of rounds, so once the middle rounds start, I have a chipstack that I can do damage with. I will play many connectors, suited 1off connectors, a wider range of suited aces and so on. I will only push when I hit big. TPTK isn't good enough, a set or better is what I'm looking for.
I would rather bust out early 4 tourneys and go real far in #5, than plod my way through and barely make the money because I was always playing catch up.

Mikelib · Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 7:21 am Post subject:

It all depends on how much money I have invested. If it is a very low entry fee, I tend to pay less attention but if I have a reasonable amount at stake I do pay 100% attention. Early in a tournament the blinds are so small that I very rarely attempt a steal as for me it is not a profitable move so early on. My strategy seems to be the opposite of your Zophar as I very rarely play any drawing hands until later on when I become very aggressive with suited connectors ect. Just wondering what your record in tournaments is like? With my play I seem to make it in the money most of the time but I am very rarely the chip leader. do you tend to make the money less but when you do finish very high?

Zophar · Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 7:55 am Post subject:

When I make the money, which is about 1 in 6 or so, I usually have a large chip stack. I used to play very tight at 1st, and reached the money a bit more often, but if I was lower in chips, I wouldn't go very far ITM. Realistically, this wasn't nearly as profitable. The outer edges of the money usually pay only 1.5 to 2x's the buy in, where the final few spots will pay 20-100x's the buy in. For example, if it's a $5 buy in, and you make the money 5x's straight but only catch the outer edge, you might make $25(say $10 payout-$5 buyin). If you make the top 5 only 1 time, your looking more at a $100(or more) payout and profit of $95(subtract 5 additional buyins, your still looking at $70).

There are alot of bad players who focus only on premium hands early on and will put it all in wih TPTK, a basic over pair and even less, hands like AJ and KQ if the board has an ace or king, etc. There is alot of deadmoney floating around early on and my goal is to get my hands on it. At this stage, you won't be battling bigger stacks for a share of it. When I wait, I find I'm battling bigger stacks(the guys who took advantage early on) and always risking my tournament.

My basic strategy in lower levels-looser, position play, hoping to flop a monster.
Mid levels-Tighten up a bit, with a focus on premium play, forcing the short stacks to play for all their chips.
End levels-pick up the aggression, taking advantage of players fold equity, fears of bubbling, etc.

I've only started to play this way in the past several months and I'm personally still learning to adapt to it. But I have found it to be more successful for me. There are some other forums that actually discuss theories on a regular basis and some top tournament players have really gone in depth about this strategy. The primary goal is always: When making the money, get near the top. Play to win, not just make the money.

DC11GE · Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 8:11 am Post subject:

That is a very good method Zophar. The "David Grey" approach. In small buyin tourneys, I play more like that because of the amount of dead money is rediculous. Probalby more then 1/2 in it are. In the higher buyins, I tend to be tighter early on, mostly cause I'm more focused on trying to get a feel for the table. Since I'm not a tourney only guy anymore, it's not a big deal to bust out early. I'll just win money in a cashgame and use some of that to try again. I do tourneys more for fun now and cash games for the bankroll. It was the other way around not long ago, but after studing my play closely, I realized what my niche is. I figure if I'm able to go far in a big tourney, I can really hit the higher limit games hard and have the BR to do it. I love the thrill of a big payoff for minimal investment.

Mikelib · Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 8:19 am Post subject:

Some very good points Zophar, I may even start to experiment with this style myself and see how I do. At the moment I am only starting to perfect my tournament play to a stage where I am making profit so I think I will practice this diffrent styles in a few freerolls and see how i do. cheers.

Pokit2s · Message Board Junkie Joined: 22 Jun 2005 Posts: 1261

I'd recommend TJ Cloutier's book on NL and PL Holdem Tournaments. I haven't read it in a while, since I've been playing mostly cash games for the past year, but I think I will brush up on it soon.

As far as early in the tournament. I usually play a cash game, check my email, etc. Probably not the best idea because paying attention always helps, but thats just what I do.

Zophar · Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 2:40 pm Post subject:

Most of the ideas pertain to large field tourneys. S&G's are played like starting at the middle of the field(for me). I will incorporate this method in the 45 man MTT's, but using a little more caution and sticking with higher suited connectors(78 being the lowest) and I generally try to stay away from the one offers.

Here's a link from cardplayer that discusses the general thinking behind this method. (I just checked pocketfives today and this is discussed in the lead article.)

http://www.cardplayer.com/magazine/article/15093

It actually mentions TJ's book in the article, however as more of a deviation from.

Mikelib · Posted: Tue Jun 20, 2006 8:49 pm Post subject:

I think i read that article before but will take take a look at it when i am a little bit more sober because at the momet it feels like having maths thrown at me:)

Pokit2s · Message Board Junkie Joined: 22 Jun 2005 Posts: 1261

allintime333 · Posted: Sat Jun 24, 2006 5:19 pm Post subject:

early on is when i take more chances and take adv of the bad players at the table

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