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2 high flush
Forum Bounty Hunter
Joined: 03 Nov 2005
Posts: 6653
Location: Climbing out of hell, life hell that is
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 Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2008 6:25 pm Post subject: A situation i always have trouble with |
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10 10 and JJ preflop. I raise a standard amount and get reraised. A call pretty much commits me to the pot (which really sucks if a Q K or A flops) and a raise could be disastrous if im against an over pair but folding just seems way too nitty. so what do you do in this spot?
Poker Stars, $1 + $0.10 NL Hold'em Tournament, 10/20 Blinds, 9 Players
LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter
BTN: 4,710
SB: 3,100
BB: 3,030
UTG: 1,400
UTG+1: 1,410
UTG+2: 1,510
Hero (MP1): 1,450
MP2: 1,500
CO: 1,450
Pre-Flop: (30) J J dealt to Hero (MP1)
UTG calls 20, 2 folds, Hero raises to 120, MP2 folds, CO raises to 440, 4 folds, Hero ???
Keep in mind that all the tournaments i play or very low stakes so there are more incredibly loose players than you might expect in a tourney with more money at stake. |
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tdawg027
Pair
Joined: 14 Jul 2008
Posts: 28
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| Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2008 6:32 pm Post subject: |
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| Close your eyes and push |
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mathman1115
Wizard of Odderation
Joined: 01 Sep 2005
Posts: 3085
Location: Land of the Fightin' Phillies
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| Posted: Tue Aug 19, 2008 7:27 pm Post subject: |
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Just pay attention to how the action plays out. In this case you made a solid raise to an UTG limper (which looks strong), and then there was a solid 3 bet. I fold JJ here without any reliable reads.
If no one had limped (or an MP player limped), and you raised from MP, and then the button 3 bets you, i probably go ahead and shove with no particular reads.
Generally, if i don't have much else to go on in a situation like this, i go by the positions of the players involved and the actions that led to the situation i'm in now.
I understand its just $1 tourney, but that's the last thing i factor into a tough decision, if i factor that in at all. Not everyone who plays micros is a maniacal idiot, and i hate when people say "if it was a higher buyin i'd probably fold, but because its the micros i tend to call." It's a very half-assed thought process people make when they want an excuse to call. |
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nobodys bizness
Straight
Joined: 28 Jul 2008
Posts: 122
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| Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2008 9:29 am Post subject: |
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With no read on the re-raise player, I fold.
Blinds are still low, you have plenty of chips left. |
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PokerJessO
Straight Flush
Joined: 28 Jun 2007
Posts: 414
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| Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2008 12:37 pm Post subject: |
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| I agree, readless I have no problem folding this situation. If you both had deeper stacks, you could treat this as a set-mining situation, but in this hand the odds just aren't there. At best you're racing against AK. Let it go and wait for a better spot. |
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2 high flush
Forum Bounty Hunter
Joined: 03 Nov 2005
Posts: 6653
Location: Climbing out of hell, life hell that is
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| Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2008 1:25 pm Post subject: |
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| mathman1115 wrote: |
| I understand its just $1 tourney, but that's the last thing i factor into a tough decision, if i factor that in at all. Not everyone who plays micros is a maniacal idiot |
I've heard someone say "dont change your play style because of the buy-in"
I dont change my play because of the buy-in, i change my play because everyone else changes their play because of the buy-in.
You are right that not everyone who plays micros is a maniacal idiot (i know because im not a maniacal idiot) but a lot of them are. enough of them to make changing your plays the right move i think.
In this case i called the raise. the flop came 7 high and i shoved. i was called by A 10 offsuit and won the hand. I think there are enough horrible players at these micro stakes to make folding a bad option. its between calling and raising imo. |
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Honest_Rob
Forum Pro
Joined: 21 Jul 2005
Posts: 6293
Location: the pale blue dot
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| Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2008 1:29 pm Post subject: |
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| mathman1115 wrote: |
I understand its just $1 tourney, but that's the last thing i factor into a tough decision, if i factor that in at all. Not everyone who plays micros is a maniacal idiot, and i hate when people say "if it was a higher buyin i'd probably fold, but because its the micros i tend to call." It's a very half-assed thought process people make when they want an excuse to call. |
I don't agree with this at all. When facing a readless opponent the stakes should definitely be taken into account. An average player in a $100 MTT is much better than an average player in a $1 MTT. I look at it like a hand range. When up against a loose player their hand range in any given situation will undoubtedly be wider as opposed to a tight player whose hand range in the same spot is much smaller. In this situation a readless average $1 MTT player's hand range is much wider than a readless average $100 MTT player's hand range. Since we have no read on this specific player we have to assume he's an average of all players at the level. That average player at $1 is just not as good as the average $100 player. |
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nobodys bizness
Straight
Joined: 28 Jul 2008
Posts: 122
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| Posted: Wed Aug 20, 2008 1:46 pm Post subject: |
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| 2 high flush wrote: |
In this case i called the raise. the flop came 7 high and i shoved. i was called by A 10 offsuit and won the hand. I think there are enough horrible players at these micro stakes to make folding a bad option. its between calling and raising imo. |
I look at it differently than that. If the players are generally looser or more manical than you it stands to reason that if you are patient an opportunity will present itself where you are clearly at an advantage.
To me with no solid reads, this hand was a complete guess. You were ahead but just as easily could have been dominated by AA, KK or QQ.
Maybe MTT's are a lot different but I am running about 33% roi on my last 50 $2. SnG's. The main change I made was folding situations like this early on and looking for better opportunities.
Now if I could just duplicate those results at the $5 level, I would be happy! |
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