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congo11
High Card
Joined: 27 Feb 2008
Posts: 1
Location: usa
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 Posted: Wed Feb 27, 2008 11:25 pm Post subject: Going pro |
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I have been playing on full tilt for a while and have won some low stakes sit and go's . I want to know what games have better odds large tournaments or high stakes game. My goal is to win a decent tournament and use the prize money to advance my poker career. I play allot of live games at the casino and boats because of the easy pickings. Just some advise on getting up to the top .
Thanks Congo11 |
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bisepost
High Card
Joined: 26 Sep 2007
Posts: 16
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| Posted: Thu Feb 28, 2008 5:49 am Post subject: |
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i'm not the best player, but it seems to me that putting your proverbial eggs in a big MTT isn't a great way to go. They usually pay out to top 10% and you need to make the final table to see any serious cash. Alternatively, grinding SnG's would probably pay out in the long run... single table SnG's pay out top 33% and 4.5 times your buy-in for being top 12%.
Grinding out SnG's seems like your best option to get a large bankroll to me. |
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griffinlord
Message Board Junkie
Joined: 20 Jul 2005
Posts: 2454
Location: The Great Plains of South Dakota
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| Posted: Fri Feb 29, 2008 2:06 pm Post subject: |
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First rule of bankroll management: Don't play above your bankroll!!!
If you play above your bankroll you WILL go broke!
As for tournaments or cash games, well, that's up to you. Both require somewhat different skill sets and psychological strengths.
Personally I find the 10% payout range of tournaments depressing and so I prefer cash games.
Others find cash games to be mind-numbingly boring and strongly prefer the risk/reward associated with tournaments.
Which do you prefer? Which do you have the patience and aptitude to play well at?
So first ask yourself what sorts of games you prefer: Cash/S&Gs/MTTS
Then figure out which game you prefer: Holdem, Omaha, Stud, high only or split-pot.
Finally are you a FL, PL, or NL player?
Answer those three questions and that's what you should focus on.
Answer those |
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EatShootNLeave
High Card
Joined: 09 Feb 2008
Posts: 7
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| Posted: Sat Mar 01, 2008 8:06 am Post subject: |
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Basically, if you're thinking of going pro, its more likely that you shouldn't than you should.
If you go pro, your poker earnings make up most of your income, its not just a skill factor; though skill really helps, and if you tilt away your bankroll there is nothing to fall back on.
You should probably play for small stakes, using at most 5% of your bankroll at any time for SnGs, 2% for multi table tournaments, and roughly 10% for cash games.
SnGs are very easy to do if you have the right strategy and hand luck, and the average person who plays 100+ of a specific buyin per month, probably has about a 33% chance of winning it before they even sit down. So that means if you play enough and figure out what works, you can build your bankroll pretty quickly and move up in stakes.
MTTs are very very sketchy. They take just the right amount of skill and way too much luck. An MTT pays usually between 9% and 12% of the entrants, so before you start, you have a 1:10 ratio of cashing, and if it takes 10 times to cash once [the lowest cash is usually just above the buyin], these probably aren't for you. They are good to play for fun when you can afford to, because if you get the right amount of luck, they pay off very well.
I don't play very much in cash games, but from what I've read and observed, the profit in the long run is stealing blinds, so you may blow a few buyins getting it right, as theres always the chance of someone calling your steals, sucking out, reraises, and so on. Most profitable for the expert.
Never go above your limits, and never play with your last dollar, as these are the times when luck fails the most.
I hope you figure out what you want to do and have fun doing it. |
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suseJdroL
Three of a Kind
Joined: 12 Mar 2008
Posts: 81
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| Posted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 10:15 am Post subject: Re: Going pro |
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| congo11 wrote: |
I have been playing on full tilt for a while and have won some low stakes sit and go's . I want to know what games have better odds large tournaments or high stakes game. My goal is to win a decent tournament and use the prize money to advance my poker career. I play allot of live games at the casino and boats because of the easy pickings. Just some advise on getting up to the top .
Thanks Congo11 |
Well, here is the deal.. Look at it from a pure odds standpoint.. Assuming you are playing at the correct level for your bankroll.. for which you might want to consult Chris Ferguson's guidelines...
An MTT normally pays 10% of the people. So, you have the potential to cash big if you win, but you gotta make the top 10% just to cash, and that typically only gives you back your buyin plus a little. The only exception I am aware of are the 18 person sngs, which are only technically MTTs, and they pay 4 people.
Single table sngs pay 33% of the people. Top prize is MUCH less for the same buyin, but you odds are almost 3.5 times as great of cashing. This is why Chris Ferguson's bankroll standards let you buy in for twice as much as you can for a MTT.
If you can play at stakes where most of your oppenents are not as strong as you, cash (or ring) games are the most consistent form of income. However, you are not likely to make the kinds of money you will if you are fortunate to win a big tournament. If you can double or triple your investment in a session, then you are doing REALLY well. You are not going to leave with 100 or 200 times your buyin. |
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drkato
Resident Forumologist
Joined: 07 Dec 2006
Posts: 1237
Location: Huntington Beach, CA
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| Posted: Sat Mar 15, 2008 11:21 am Post subject: |
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| EatShootNLeave wrote: |
| SnGs are very easy to do if you have the right strategy and hand luck, and the average person who plays 100+ of a specific buyin per month, probably has about a 33% chance of winning it before they even sit down. So that means if you play enough and figure out what works, you can build your bankroll pretty quickly and move up in stakes. |
I think all of your advice was good, except this portion above is just a bit off. The % makes sense, but the idea is that you have the chance of profiting, not necessarily winning. Maybe that is what you meant, but I just wanted to make the distinction. When I am playing MTTs, I usually go for broke, because anything outside of the final table is simply breaking even for a large investment of time. With SNGs however (of which I will multi-table about 3-4), if you profit them regularly you can grow your bankroll quickly.
Second point to the OP, BR management is so huge, and this is coming from a player who simply doesn't have the discipline to incorporate it. If you do as I do, and constantly take shots outside of your BR, you will be a losing player. You can look at my Sharkscope stats and see, I am nearing 5K games played, and am down over $2K. Yet my average ROI is 2%. Seems odd wouldn't you think? What it says is that over the long haul, I can be a winning player, but that I take way too many shots outside my BR and go bust. I keep trying to work on my game and my discipline, and the latter is simply something you can't overlook if you are seriously thinking about becoming a pro. |
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