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mathman1115 · Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2007 5:28 pm Post subject: playing the river

I struggle with value river bets at the micros, mainly because its hard to put some of these goofy players on a hand. This was my first hand at the table, so no reads.
On the river, do i value bet here, check to induce a bluff, or check because i may not have the best hand? What does he have? My read and action to follow, along with hand results.

Full Tilt Poker Game #3103301167: Table Torino - $0.50/$1 - Limit Hold'em - 15:28:32 ET - 2007/07/30
Seat 1: RedLotos ($13.90)
Seat 2: Mathman1115 ($20)
Seat 3: DonkeyKong824 ($10.25)
Seat 4: Ronemo ($15.25)
Seat 5: Mzxxmt ($35.40)
Seat 6: littlefunds ($20.95)
Seat 7: psstpacs ($43.35)
Seat 8: Shinobi7 ($20)
Seat 9: GFMPaulus ($59.15), is sitting out
RedLotos posts the small blind of $0.25
Mathman1115 posts the big blind of $0.50
The button is in seat #7
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Mathman1115 [Jd Jc]
DonkeyKong824 folds
Ronemo folds
Mzxxmt folds
littlefunds calls $0.50
psstpacs raises to $1
RedLotos folds
Mathman1115 raises to $1.50
littlefunds folds
psstpacs calls $0.50
*** FLOP *** [8d 2h 6c]
Mathman1115 bets $0.50
psstpacs calls $0.50
*** TURN *** [8d 2h 6c] [2s]
Mathman1115 bets $1
psstpacs calls $1
*** RIVER *** [8d 2h 6c 2s] [5c]
Mathman1115 ???

Big Slick x13x · Forum Icon Joined: 18 Jun 2006 Posts: 4117 Location: ROK

I'm betting this river for value. It's so unlikely that he hit a better hand then you and at the micros they'll pay you off with one pair a lot.

Honest_Rob · Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2007 5:44 pm Post subject:

I agree with Slick. There's no flush possibility, a straight is so damn unlikely(he raised a limper) and he just called your 3 bet preflop. It feels like AK, AQ or TT, 99. I think he would have 4 bet preflop or raised you at some point with QQ+. The only thing that I think you realistically have to worry about is a set but if he played it that slow and raises you on the river just call it down and move on. Most often you'll have the best hand.

Strasse · Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2007 5:59 pm Post subject:

I agree w/ everything said so far, I'm betting this for value. Also, you should take a note on littlefunds that he is capable of limp/folding, which right there says that he is probably better than most people at the table.

Riddim · Posted: Mon Jul 30, 2007 6:34 pm Post subject:

I'd probably bet a 6 there. That should make my opinion on what to do with jacks pretty clear.

roger39 · High Card Joined: 06 Jul 2007 Posts: 5 Location: Thailand

AA KK QQ - he did not cap pre-flop and slow played the flop and turn.

2 - x he raised pre-flop, not likely. Same for 3-4

88 66 55 Possible but would he raise pre-flop with them? Maybe 88 but most likely he would raise your turn bet.

Bet and see if he has JJ same as you.

fire_eyes_2k · Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 2:49 am Post subject:

Villain has A high or K high. The river is valuetown

mathman1115 · Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 5:54 pm Post subject:

Results:

I checked the river, he checked it back. I showed my JJ, and he mucked. He had AK.

I posted this because i knew i made a mistake, but then thought twice about it. He didn't cap preflop, so i eliminated AA and KK.
I bet the flop, he called. I bet the turn, and he just called again. So now i eliminated QQ, TT, and 99. His only logical holding was a big Ace, so i figured he wouldn't call with Ace high (perhaps that was my mistake). So i checked hoping to induce a bluff from him, but he didn't bite.

So, if i have him on a high ace, is betting still correct? Is it more likely he'll call a BB with Ace high then bet the river with it if i check? Is the fact that i three bet preflop the reason why inducing the bluff doesn't work here?
It turns out this guy was a pretty solid player. Does the fact that he was solid affect the actions there? What if i know he's a donk?

Riddim · Posted: Wed Aug 01, 2007 7:00 pm Post subject:

People are generally much less likely to bet than to call when you check. They're usually not calling just to hit, but also because they think they have a decent amount of showdown value. Without significant history only really horrible players will bet when checked to there. It's such a typical example of where betting is bad because you're folding out worse hands and getting called by better ones when you can just check and see a showdown.

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