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OKay5
Two Pair
Joined: 30 Dec 2006
Posts: 59
Location: Dortmund, Germany
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 Posted: Sat Mar 03, 2007 8:02 pm Post subject: Making big laydowns |
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Hi,
at wich point should i have folded, after 5th or 6th? I sureley made a mistake to call on 6th, or did I?
Full Tilt Poker Game #1914593700: Table Banburry Cross - $0.25/$0.50 Ante $0.05 - Limit Razz - 19:55:25 ET - 2007/03/03
Seat 3: Tristran ($2.65)
Seat 6: redrum33 ($3.15)
Seat 7: OKay5 ($13.20)
Seat 8: cloppy ($7.30)
redrum33 antes $0.05
Tristran antes $0.05
cloppy antes $0.05
OKay5 antes $0.05
*** 3RD STREET ***
Dealt to Tristran [3h]
Dealt to redrum33 [7h]
Dealt to OKay5 [2d Ac] [4s]
Dealt to cloppy [9d]
cloppy is high with [9d]
cloppy brings in for $0.10
Tristran folds
redrum33 calls $0.10
OKay5 completes it to $0.25
cloppy folds
cloppy is sitting out
redrum33 calls $0.15
*** 4TH STREET ***
Dealt to redrum33 [7h] [6d]
Dealt to OKay5 [2d Ac 4s] [3s]
OKay5 bets $0.25
redrum33 calls $0.25
jeffulltilt sits down
*** 5TH STREET ***
Dealt to redrum33 [7h 6d] [2h]
Dealt to OKay5 [2d Ac 4s 3s] [Jd]
jeffulltilt adds $5
redrum33 bets $0.50
OKay5 calls $0.50
*** 6TH STREET ***
Dealt to redrum33 [7h 6d 2h] [8h]
Dealt to OKay5 [2d Ac 4s 3s Jd] [Jc]
redrum33 bets $0.50
evalt sits down
OKay5: holy lord
evalt adds $5
OKay5 has 15 seconds left to act
OKay5 calls $0.50
*** 7TH STREET ***
Dealt to OKay5 [2d Ac 4s 3s Jd Jc] [Qh]
redrum33 bets $0.50
OKay5 folds
Uncalled bet of $0.50 returned to redrum33
redrum33 mucks
redrum33 wins the pot ($3.15)
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $3.30 | Rake $0.15
Seat 3: Tristran folded on 3rd St.
Seat 6: redrum33 collected ($3.15), mucked
Seat 7: OKay5 folded on 7th St.
Seat 8: cloppy folded on 3rd St. |
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PokerAA
Message Board Junkie
Joined: 24 Nov 2006
Posts: 1610
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| Posted: Sat Mar 03, 2007 9:31 pm Post subject: |
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i would call on 5th and on 6th, im not sure what i would do, i always make different moves in that situation, but i think more times than not i would fold it on 6th... any good player would probably tell u to fold
what would asfis do? lol listen to him, NOT to me  |
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Tiera Starr
Message Board Junkie
Joined: 01 Mar 2006
Posts: 1928
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| Posted: Sat Mar 03, 2007 10:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Depending on the opponent, a call on 5th and a call on 6th followed by a raise on 7th may get your opponent to fold to you, but you would want a pretty good read on the opponent to try and pull that off. |
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ftn_chris
Message Board Junkie
Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 1181
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| Posted: Sat Mar 03, 2007 10:35 pm Post subject: |
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| Tiera Starr wrote: |
| Depending on the opponent, a call on 5th and a call on 6th followed by a raise on 7th may get your opponent to fold to you, but you would want a pretty good read on the opponent to try and pull that off. |
did you honestly just say that?
its a 25/50c game. the villains UP CARDS are enough for them to call a raise on 7th by ok5 |
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Foxy_Boxer
Straight
Joined: 05 Jan 2007
Posts: 105
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| Posted: Sun Mar 04, 2007 9:55 pm Post subject: |
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Your opponent just limped in, implying he may not have even the 7-low he's representing. Of course, some opponents will just limp with the 3-card 7, so you have to know the player a little to be sure. Because I'd assume he's not starting with anything better than an 87, I'd definitely make the call on 6th. I would think at that point that catching a 7 or even an 8 would give you the winning hand. If you know the guy did probably start with a 3-card 7 AND he's unlikely to bluff, you might consider folding on 6th. Still, even if he has the 76-low made, you will probably win if you catch a 7 (unless of course he improves to a 6-low). I just think your draw is too smooth to fold at that point.
And like ftn_chris said, at these stakes, your opponent won't be folding to the "sophisticated" bluff Tiera Starr mentioned, so just fold the river. Maybe save that play for the $100-200 game  . |
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fozzy71
High Card
Joined: 05 Mar 2007
Posts: 6
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| Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2007 11:08 pm Post subject: |
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assuming there were no dead cards (which of course there are at least a couple) if u have:
If You Have 4 - 3 - 2 - A - K - Q :
The probability that the final strength of your hand after seven cards will be...
8 hi - 34.78% - 1.88 to 1 odds against making it
7 hi - 26.09% - 2.83 to 1 odds against making it
6 hi - 17.39% - 4.75 to 1 odds against making it
http://www.razzpokerstrategy.com/Odds.htm
Pot of $2.25 or so on 6th street - he bets .50 - u call .50 to win $2.75+
2.75 / .5 = 5.5/1 pot odds
U played it right 
IF your hand was A23KQ4 - we might have some things to discuss 
Good luck at the tables |
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Big Slick x13x
Forum Icon
Joined: 18 Jun 2006
Posts: 4300
Location: ROK
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| Posted: Mon Mar 05, 2007 11:44 pm Post subject: |
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fozzy please stop misquoting that site. You have the same odds of hitting a 8 as you do a 7 or 6 and slightly better odds of hitting a wheel. That site doesn't base anything on dead cards. In this case one 8,7, and 6 are dead and all the 5s are live. so he has 13 outs going to 7th. 40 unknown cards and 13 make his hand 40:13 => 3.07:1 to improve on 7th. It's really that simple. He called one big bet to win 5 that were already in that pot 5:1 > 3:1 so it's an easy call going to 7th.
Also, KQ432A is pretty much the same as JJ432A in this situation. |
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fozzy71
High Card
Joined: 05 Mar 2007
Posts: 6
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| Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 1:50 am Post subject: |
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| I know why i never posted in a forum before. Its been short and sweet. You wont ever see me back here. Good Luck 2 ya. Silly me - I was here to have fun and learn. |
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Big Slick x13x
Forum Icon
Joined: 18 Jun 2006
Posts: 4300
Location: ROK
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| Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 3:13 am Post subject: |
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| dude, don't leave just because you had a little wrong information. I'm really sorry if I came off as harsh. Just some mistakes I see so often even after someone tells them other wise and a lot of invalid information is put out. I just want the correct information out there. Stay, learn, get better. I'm hoping you at least learned something from my posts, even if I did seem like a prick. |
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fozzy71
High Card
Joined: 05 Mar 2007
Posts: 6
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| Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 11:09 am Post subject: |
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Yes - u did come off like a prick. Perhaps I should of stated it more clearly.
I assumed all you smart forum guys would understand that when i said:
8 hi - 34.78% - (8hi or better) 13/40 = 32.5%
7 hi - 26.09% - (7hi or better) 10/40 = 25%
6 hi - 17.39% - (6hi or better) 7/40 = 17.5%
I didnt mis-quote that site, they werent clear or precise enuff when making their charts. I was actually smart enough to infer what they meant by it. Guess I should of spelled it out word for word for you. Sorry, it WILL NOT happen again.
Perhaps if YOU ARE so smart - you should make a proper chart for all your forum buddies. That way they wouldn't get "wrong" information. 
Bein rude and arrogant IS fun. I see why u do it, now. Good luck with your forums.
Fozzy OUT. |
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Big Slick x13x
Forum Icon
Joined: 18 Jun 2006
Posts: 4300
Location: ROK
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| Posted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 11:30 am Post subject: |
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| fozzy71 wrote: |
Perhaps if YOU ARE so smart - you should make a proper chart for all your forum buddies. That way they wouldn't get "wrong" information.
Bein rude and arrogant IS fun. I see why u do it, now. Good luck with your forums.
Fozzy OUT. |
See that's just un-called for. I didn't do it because it's fun, I didn't even realize I was being rude until after I read it back. I was just frustrated, then admitted to my mistake and apologized, just to have you come back and throw it in my face.
I just don't see the point of putting 8 hi, 7 hi, 6 hi all in there if all that is necessary to win is 8 hi. It's complicating what should be a simple problem. 13 outs, 40 possibilities ~3:1. Easy. When you separate them out like that it screws it all up, because you're only hitting an 8 hi when you hit the 8, the rest of the time you improve you have better and if that's all covered in the 8 high calculation why do you need a separate calculation? You see what I'm saying. Keep it simple.
Honestly, I appreciate you bringing more information into this forum. I didn't know about that razz website.
I'm not going to take my time to make a chart because I'm sure there are charts already made out there and if people have specific questions that I can answer I'm always happy to do so. |
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