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BoxcarJack · Last edited by BoxcarJack on Fri Oct 20, 2006 10:21 pm; edited 2 times in total

Those who play live poker use their instincts all the time to read their opponents. On-line poker lacks direct mannerism tells. Are hand odds the only thing we have to work with?

One skill that I'm learning to compensate with in my arsenal is intuition.

I get a kick out of forum posts and live chat where players complain about the hands that their opponents play and win with. "You shouldn't have played that hand there" "That's a donk move and you got away with it!" Isn't it possible that they played 9-4 offsuit because they had a strong feeling about it for whatever reason?

Wouldn't you like to harness the strength of all those marginal hands you mucked and would have busted the whole table with?

I'm reading up on poker all the time, I want to employ the time tested techniques that give me the best chance at being a solid player. But I feel developing my sixth sense and playing some unconventional poker is the greatest kick of all. Doesn't it get boring looking for those same hands over and over again?

I'm not kidding myself that I'm Houdini, but I'm sure going to work on keeping my eyes open to everything that's happening AND tuning into my inner vision.

I'd be happy to hear what others believe and have experienced.

--Box

Big Slick x13x · Forum Icon Joined: 18 Jun 2006 Posts: 4318 Location: ROK

I actually play live poker a lot based on feel. Sometimes the conventional "book" style of poker actually gets me in trouble. I'll look down at a hand, say QQ, and think "this hand is going to get me in trouble" And sure enough I get someone all in on the flop of Jack high, they have TPTK, AJ and hit the Ace on the river to take half my stack. Had I listened to my gut I would have folded it preflop. But folding QQ preflop is a very bad decision in the long run.

Then again I've pushed all in preflop with 42 suited preflop trying to steal because I got a good feeling about it. I got called by pocket fours and I hit a flush. So it has it's ups and downs. I can't really describe the feeling more then I have. I do know that I've been playing cards for most of my life and can't really explain why the gut feeling I get is right most of the time.

Tiera Starr · Message Board Junkie Joined: 01 Mar 2006 Posts: 1933

I usually do well when I listen to my preflop gut feelings to FOLD when I dont want to.

Sometimes I'll have a moderately strong hand and my gut tells me to fold it. I want to play, but typically, if I listen and do fold, I'll then kick myself when I see the flop that hit it. However, if the hand plays out, invariably, someone has either hit better or catches their draw on the turn or river. Basically, by folding preflop, I saved myself a lot of chips that I would have lost to a bad beat or tough break.

Examples are:

I have a mid pocket pair and three limpers ahead of me. I consider limping to see if I hit, or pushing to try for a steal or one-on-one coinflip, when my internal flag jumps up and says FOLD. I resist and want to just limp and see, but decide to play it safe and fold. Another limper, and the big blind makes it five seeing the flop, which would have given me a set. Then I see some action and think that big pot could have been mine. There are some straight or flush draw possibilities out there, which the action is likely trying to chase out. The turn gives a third card to complete a draw, and I think my (would-have-been) set probably got bested, but the bets are small compared to the pot, and I would have stayed in. Then the river card pairs the board - giving me a (would-have-been) full house. I'm regretting not playing the hand, until someone reveals their pair that gives them four-of-a-kind.

Maybe I have KsQs, but reluctantly listen to my instincts and lay it down preflop. Then I see the flop Qh6s5s (TPTK and a 2nd-flush draw). However, when someone else shows their set, or hits their straight or nut-flush, I thank my lucky stars for the chips I didn't waste on that hand.

Sometimes I'm too quick to act and dont get the gut feeling until it is too late. For example, today, I had 99 UTG. I bet 1/3 my stack and got the "I shouldn't have done that feeling." My bet was about 80% of the shortstacks stack (who was in mid position) and I remember feeling that he was the one to worry about. Well everyone else folded except the shortstack who pushed all in. Getting 1:10 pot odds with no further risk, I knew I had to call even though I didn't think my 9s would hold out. Even when the cards were flipped and I saw his ducks, my dread was not alleviated. He hit his set on the turn, and the nines remained elusive. A few hands later, I had KK vs the other shortstack allin. (Answered the phone so didn't see his cards, but he hit a straight and crippled me.) Then I get A8 offsuit in the big blind. That's enough for me to push with as shortstack I think. But an early position raises for more than my stack, and he receives two callers ahead of me. I cannot go allin with A8o vs three other players. However my inner voice is saying "the cards are good". I hesitate too long and timeout. Flop shows two 8s, and the river brings a third (so I would have quadrupled my stack with four-kind) but instead the early position raiser takes it down with his overpair (pocket kings).

====

Of course sometimes my gut tells me to go with a hand instead, but I've had less success with those. Probably only 50% pan out, so I'm less likely to go with my gut there.

e_ratledge · Royal Flush Joined: 24 Oct 2005 Posts: 750

junkbutton · Posted: Thu Oct 19, 2006 9:00 am Post subject:

There is nothing wrong with playing 94o. Bring it in for a raise to steal the blinds, or to fake strength if the flop brings big cards. But to limp with them or call a preflop raise with them because you feel that you're going to hit the flop hard is not a good way to play and will lose money long term. Of course if you think you can outplay your opponents, there's nothing wrong with it. But you can't expect to show the hand down and win.

I HATE CAPS · Straight Flush Joined: 05 Oct 2006 Posts: 357

i think "gut feelings" are really just your brain analyzing everything that has happened in the game up to that point. of course i mean after the flop and maybe the turn or river. sometimes a guy bets into a pot and you just know ... you just KNOW that the guy is bluffing. you dont know why you know you just do so you call and your right(sometimes). we all know the human brain has undescribable potential and possibly your "gut feelings" are really just your brain telling you what it thinks based on what it has stored subconsiously.

griffinlord · Posted: Thu Oct 19, 2006 11:07 am Post subject:

acesfullokings9 · Posted: Sat Oct 21, 2006 7:37 am Post subject:

I HATE CAPS · Straight Flush Joined: 05 Oct 2006 Posts: 357

BoxcarJack · Posted: Mon Oct 23, 2006 8:07 am Post subject:

I was starting to get ticked off that my precious intuition was being characterized as wishful thinking. But I have to laugh. For me, right now it is hit or miss. Sure, there are times that cards have a golden halo around them pre-flop and I do well with them. Each session is different. There are times when I'm genuinely wired in and can really feel it. I can't assume that each time I sit down I'm going to be "on", at least at my present level of sensitivity. I believe that everything has an energy signature and that a card's potential is floating out there to be tuned into.

All I know now is that it's going to take a lot of work to develop my game. Intuition is the icing on the cake, not the whole cake. To use gut feelings to make every single decision would take more concentration than I currently possess.

Inner listening is never a bad thing. My gut really says that poker is not the best use of my time. But I made a deal with my higher self that I use poker to strengthen my link to the messages it sends. Now all I need to do is get it to care about my poker habit when there are so many other things that I could be pouring my time into.

I will post to this forum when I have any hot developments on the ESP front.

The broken clock analogy is one of my favorite quotes, so I have to laugh at that too.

Thanks for your input all.

--Box

feverfive · Pair Joined: 22 Oct 2006 Posts: 21 Location: Massachusetts

Playing with your gut is fine. It's your hand, it's your gut! Smile

With all the strategy and thought process, playing your gut should be done along the way. Statistics are only as good as the actual flop, not the ones in theory. Sure, it'll upset some people because when your gut is right and you get four of a kind 2's holding a 7 2, and it will confuse others (which isn't bad). In a 2 or 3 hour session, I'll play my gut once or twice an hour. I do it for fun, and sometimes it pay offs, and sometimes I look like a clown.

Jeff

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