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PokerNome · Guest

I have read a few threads on playing stud in PL form, and it sounds quite interesting. From what I've heard, 4th and 5th streats are dealt at the same time, and 7th is deal face up. With these adjustments, and maybe another tweek or two, I think a Pot Limit mixed game such as HORSE would be fun, challenging, and have very dynamic play.

What are your thoughts?

byamamoto1 · Bay Area Bidness Joined: 11 Aug 2005 Posts: 2175

i already think horse is dynamic and challenging as is. pot limit would make it ridiculous, IMO. people are in love with being able to bet people off hands, but being able to win in a limit situation is a major skill. pot limit razz, stud and stud 8/b, there would be crazy betting in your version of the game since you basically get two cards after 3rd street and you have 5 cards already. also if 7th street is dealt face up, it doesn't leave too much to the imagination to determine what the other player is holding, especially if you're counting cards along the way. i'd say it'd be real difficult to implement this kind of play.

PokerNome · Guest

I do strongly agree that limit games are great, and that they do infact require quite a bit of skill, but at the same time, PL games add an extra dymension with the ability to force draws out and denfend your hands, as well as representing hands and bluffing a bit more strongly.

Also, with the adjustments to the Stud games, it was just what I've heard, and I think that there is much room for improvment to make a fun and playable PL Stud game. I do agree that PL Stud could get crazy, but there could be a limit-to-PL stucture to Stud's betting, as in starting the frist betting rounds as Limit, then on 5th or 6th, switch to PL. This would allow people to get rid of people chasing flushes/straights to the river (defending hands), but still keep the pots controlled while hands are still developing on the early streets. Also, the 7th street being deal face up is something that I'm also not too fond of, and having it face down could add a level of deception, execially to a PL game.

Also, having a PL version of HORSE could attract more players to new games and possibly lead them into the world of limit, and also give a good combination of games that could accomadate both the gun-ho TV viewers, and the knowlegeable mixedgame players (giving the experianced players a new pool of fish to catch).

Any suggestions are great, I'll be introducing a few of my ideas for PL games my homegames and I'll update on new ideas.

dmoore1998 · Posted: Mon Apr 24, 2006 9:34 pm Post subject:

I wouldn't mind seeing the HE and O8/b played as pot limit in some horse games, but I can't really envision playing stud games as PL. Any poker game where you aren't sharing community cards just puts so many possibilities out there that it's nearly impossible to figure out what someone has well enough to play it as PL. In flop games you can see "ok this is the nuts, this is the 2nd nuts, etc". In a stud game I think it's just going to turn into an all-in fest with nothing more than a good draw to a flush or straight. For example: Yesterday I lost in 7-stud with a full house to a straight flush, My opponent was showing 3 cards to a flush but only 2 were used in the straight flush, the other 3 were all hidden, there was absolutely no way in my wildest dreams that I could put them on that. In a flop game I can narrow my opponent down to 2 cards, and we're sharing the same ones. I think PL is going to lead to lots more bad beats and people just shoving all-in on draws when they've only got 4 cards.

Along the same lines, PL razz would be the worst game ever, unlike stud you don't even have a made hand till at least 5th, even then most people are still drawing to a better hand. The suicide (and homicide) rate is going to dramatically increase if I'm playing PL razz and go all-in with A234 only to go brick brick brick or pair pair pair once I'm all-in.

duelindalton · Pair Joined: 30 Mar 2006 Posts: 38 Location: Tampa

I disagree with the idea of pot limit in HORSE. Now in stud or razz or any of the other games being pot limit is ok as long as the game stays the same. But in HORSE if you make it pot limit, you would have people only playing HE, and very aggressivly too, and laying back on the others. HORSE games then would be decided primarily on HE games alone. A limit structure allows a more even playing field throughout all 5 games, and that is what HORSE is about. Why enter a horse tourny to only play HE, cuz I can almost guarentee this scenario. Now I wouldnt disagree to an adjustment where final table is pot limit or no limit for that matter. At that point decisions are made more carefully and the blind structure has reached a point where large antes are invloved, this makes for a more reasonable pot limit situation. But as always this is only my opinion.

byamamoto1 · Bay Area Bidness Joined: 11 Aug 2005 Posts: 2175

very good point. the reason FT doesn't offer HORSE cash games is because they are afraid people will sit out during certain games and only play omaha or hold'em. if people wanted to play a hold'em not HORSE, they could enter themselves in a hold'em tournament.

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