Online Poker Forum at Full Tilt Poker

venusdiode · High Card Joined: 31 Jul 2005 Posts: 19 Location: LA

I just started playing pot limit and some no limit Omaha not too long ago, and I was wondering if anyone could break down the usual winning hands for me. I know that is hard because it all depends on the community cards and the players, but just an idea would be good, so I know how far to play a straight or trips or whatever. Thanks everyone.

GTKID · Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 10:09 am Post subject:

AAKK double suited is the best starting hand. The next ones are debated as some people like AAJ10 double suited for its straights. Others go to AAQQ double suited I believe. I don't have the exact top 10 hand breakdown on me. If you have the opportunity to get all your money in preflop with AAxx you are a mathematical favorite over any hand though. I see a lot of KKxx vs AAxx in the omaha tourneys. Play hands with possibilities like wraps and nut flushes. In omaha if something can beat your hand, its probably out there.

GripHoldOn · Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 11:54 am Post subject: Re:

PlayingTheBoard · Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 12:08 pm Post subject: Omaha starting hands

...if you can find someone willing to push in preflop with KKxx, try and play them Very Happy

Try to avoid investing heavily in high pairs without much support--like KK83 or QQ72. These hands generally need to hit a set to win and don't have any support (no straight draws or nut flush draws) from their other two cards. Also, try and play against people who always play aces in an obvious, straightforward manner. You know the types--they won't raise preflop unless they have AAxx, then will make a pot-sized bet on the flop regardless of the texture of the flop. (Don't be one of these guys. Very Happy

)

I would suggest varying your preflop play enough to make it difficult for your opponents to read you--i.e., be willing to raise with some drawing hands, especially with four cards that work well together (i.e., be willing to put in the first raise not only with the super-strong hands like AAJTds or AAKQds, etc., but hands like 6543ds or 7765). If you raise only with paired and suited picture cards, then observant opponents should know when you miss the flop entirely.

GTKID · Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 12:38 pm Post subject:

Yes against another AA you can be a dog and I wasn't aware there was a hand that posted slightly better against any AAxx. This might be true I'm just going by what I have read in many different things. That said I would still be willing to put my money in with AAxx. The KKxx people I see putting the money in is ussually only in the tournaments. I find Full Tilt's omaha cash games to be very tight ussually. Mainly because if a fish does come he is bust in a few hands.

I was pretty sure the 8910j hand was the best hand vs AAxx but still not actually a favorite.

GripHoldOn · Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 1:52 pm Post subject:

Check out the Cardplayer Omaha Poker Odds Calculator for yourself. 89TJ double suited is 50.6% to win against a rainbow AA62.

GTKID · Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 2:02 pm Post subject:

I can't at the moment. Blockers, work, etc. I'll take your word for it. But is aa62 the only time your a dog? or do other AA fall into this. And if so I would still put my money in with AAxx when the worst I can be is at 1.2% disadvantage against a perfect hand and I have to have aa62 rainbow.

Remo · Full House Joined: 15 Jul 2005 Posts: 158

my advice for you playing omaha if you don';t flop it have a wrap str8 draw or flop a set with a non suited or str8 board fold u should be able to tell what ur up against say u have trip 7's and the board is 7-8-9 with 2 diamonds and u get raised i would fold like the other posts said if somethin is out there that beats you it probably is also that was good advice with a hand like KK72 i might consider folding it in early position but try and win the pot in late with a big raise hope that wasn't too confusing

Remo · Full House Joined: 15 Jul 2005 Posts: 158

also i can't find my omaha book right now but i know for a fact that either 9-10-J-Q or 10-J-Q-K is a top 10 starting hand i also remember that a hand like 4-5-6-7 can get in alot of troube i'm by no means an expert in omaha so if i'm givin this dude bad information someone let us both know LATER

GripHoldOn · Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 2:48 pm Post subject: Re:

GTKID · Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 3:04 pm Post subject:

I see. Obviously AAxx vs another AAxx you can be a dog but I was going for the general advice to someone new to omaha, that if you can get all your money in preflop with AAxx then you should. It would be high variance of course. In tournaments its how I see most people bust and double up.

PlayingTheBoard · Posted: Tue Aug 02, 2005 3:04 pm Post subject: Preflop play

Yes, I think if you're going to get heads-up, all-in preflop then you'd take your AAxx to war in any and all situations, regardless of your kickers. I like taking either extreme with my AAxx hands--either limp in for the minimum and try to win a big hand with an A-high flop or nut flush draw (else you can simply fold if someone shows strength and would have lost only the minimum), OR try and get all of your money in against one other opponent. What you don't want to happen is to have built the pot substantially and still have a lot of chips left for postflop play, and then have to defend with your AAxx out of position (or even in position) against several players, trying to figure out whether a T95 flop (or something to that effect) hit anyone.

In Super/System 2, Lyle Berman states that what separates average players from really good ones is how much money average players lose with aces, and how much they lose with underfulls. I think this is an excellent point, all too often you see people play aces too obviously and don't take into account the texture of the flop when they make a postflop bet.

To me, the best way to combat this is to vary your preflop play a bit (don't get too crazy with raises with any four cards), or go the other route, forget raising preflop altogether, and simply execute soundly after the flop comes down. I prefer the former, in that opponents may have a tougher time reading you and you'll generally play bigger pots and force people into tougher decisions (of course, playing larger pots in and of itself isn't necessarily a good thing--if you're not playing a sound strategy then you'll simply lose more over the long run. Bigger pots simply increases your variance, which is only a good thing if you're making +EV decisions, or your opponents constantly making -EV ones.)

	Full Tilt Poker is licensed by the Kahnawake Gaming Commission. © Copyright 2004 - 2005 FullTiltPoker.com., All Rights Reserved