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Pil Sung
Four of a Kind
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 258
Location: Georgia
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 Posted: Sun Apr 27, 2008 4:39 pm Post subject: To be or not to be (aggressive) that is the question |
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I'm sure that some will disagree with my line, but I thought it was the best way to maximize my winnings.
Full Tilt Poker Game #: Table $2/$4 Ante $0.40 - Limit Stud H/L
A antes $0.40
Pil Sung antes $0.40
B antes $0.40
Villian 1 antes $0.40
Villian 2 antes $0.40
*** 3RD STREET ***
Dealt to A [3d]
Dealt to Villian 1 [Th]
Dealt to B [Ad]
Dealt to Pil Sung [2c 3s] [5c]
Dealt to Villian 2 [9s]
A is low with [3d]
A brings in for $0.50
UrOwnedFish adds $40
Villian 1 calls $0.50
B folds
Pil Sung calls $0.50
Villian 2 calls $0.50
*** 4TH STREET ***
Dealt to A [3d] [Kh]
Dealt to Villian 1 [Th] [7d]
Dealt to Pil Sung [2c 3s 5c] [4c]
Dealt to Villian 2 [9s] [Ts]
A checks
Villian 1 has 15 seconds left to act
Villian 1 bets $2
Pil Sung calls $2
Villian 2 raises to $4
A folds
B adds $276
Villian 1 raises to $6
Pil Sung calls $4
Villian 2 calls $2
*** 5TH STREET ***
Dealt to Villian 1 [Th 7d] [Jd]
Dealt to Pil Sung [2c 3s 5c 4c] [6h]
Dealt to Villian 2 [9s Ts] [8d]
Villian 1 bets $4
Pil Sung calls $4
Villian 2 calls $4
*** 6TH STREET ***
Dealt to Villian 1 [Th 7d Jd] [8h]
Dealt to Pil Sung [2c 3s 5c 4c 6h] [Qs]
Dealt to Villian 2 [9s Ts 8d] [Qh]
Villian 2 checks
Villian 1 has 15 seconds left to act
Villian 1 checks
Pil Sung bets $4
Villian 2 calls $4
Villian 1 calls $4
*** 7TH STREET ***
Dealt to Pil Sung [2c 3s 5c 4c 6h Qs] [7h]
Villian 2 bets $4
Villian 1 has 15 seconds left to act
Villian 1 folds
Pil Sung calls $4
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Villian 2 shows [As Td 9s Ts 8d Qh 9h] two pair, Tens and Nines, for high
Pil Sung shows [7h 3s 5c 4c 6h Qs 2c] a straight, Seven high, for high and 6,5,4,3,2, for low
Pil Sung wins the high pot ($26) with a straight, Seven high
Pil Sung wins the low pot ($26) with 6,5,4,3,2 |
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krazybangs
Message Board Junkie
Joined: 21 Nov 2005
Posts: 1373
Location: Beyond Tilt
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| Posted: Sun Apr 27, 2008 4:53 pm Post subject: |
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With that board I don't think they were willing to bet after 4th, but you maximized what you could by betting if you assumed they would just check after 5th.
Why didn't you raise on 7th after Villain 1 folded? |
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Zophar
Moderator
Joined: 26 Oct 2005
Posts: 3584
Location: East Coast
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| Posted: Sun Apr 27, 2008 5:24 pm Post subject: |
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As played is fine imo, EXCEPT 7th! You have to raise here. Even w/o a straight, only low vs. a high hand, you have to raise here. People will fold occasionally.
It's not even a good set up for later hands, as they'll be more timid in playing you. You may pick up a few pots uncontested, but you'll likely get less action. |
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Pil Sung
Four of a Kind
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 258
Location: Georgia
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| Posted: Sun Apr 27, 2008 5:45 pm Post subject: |
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| Zophar wrote: |
As played is fine imo, EXCEPT 7th! You have to raise here. Even w/o a straight, only low vs. a high hand, you have to raise here. People will fold occasionally.
It's not even a good set up for later hands, as they'll be more timid in playing you. You may pick up a few pots uncontested, but you'll likely get less action. |
I understand your point, but I felt that I was most likely chopping, and no reason to bet. |
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Zophar
Moderator
Joined: 26 Oct 2005
Posts: 3584
Location: East Coast
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| Posted: Sun Apr 27, 2008 6:07 pm Post subject: |
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| Pil Sung wrote: |
| Zophar wrote: |
As played is fine imo, EXCEPT 7th! You have to raise here. Even w/o a straight, only low vs. a high hand, you have to raise here. People will fold occasionally.
It's not even a good set up for later hands, as they'll be more timid in playing you. You may pick up a few pots uncontested, but you'll likely get less action. |
I understand your point, but I felt that I was most likely chopping, and no reason to bet. |
This should never be a reason not to bet(or raise). That's the great part about this game as opposed to O8, you know which way your opponents hands are going. If I've got a made low on 5th vs a high only opponent, and I have at minimum an A or backdoor draw, I start raising. I know I've got 1/2 the pot covered and outs to a scoop.
The lost rake will be insignificant to the bets won. If you know with 100% certainty that you are splitting at worst on 7th, you should always bet or 2 bet. If they 3 bet, then just call, because they do have it. For the difference in rake, you have to be right only 10% of the time or so. There are plenty of occasions where you check/check on 7th and your low w/2pr beats a high only hand that never made it. |
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Pil Sung
Four of a Kind
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 258
Location: Georgia
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| Posted: Sun Apr 27, 2008 6:49 pm Post subject: |
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| Zophar wrote: |
| Pil Sung wrote: |
| Zophar wrote: |
As played is fine imo, EXCEPT 7th! You have to raise here. Even w/o a straight, only low vs. a high hand, you have to raise here. People will fold occasionally.
It's not even a good set up for later hands, as they'll be more timid in playing you. You may pick up a few pots uncontested, but you'll likely get less action. |
I understand your point, but I felt that I was most likely chopping, and no reason to bet. |
This should never be a reason not to bet(or raise). That's the great part about this game as opposed to O8, you know which way your opponents hands are going. If I've got a made low on 5th vs a high only opponent, and I have at minimum an A or backdoor draw, I start raising. I know I've got 1/2 the pot covered and outs to a scoop.
The lost rake will be insignificant to the bets won. If you know with 100% certainty that you are splitting at worst on 7th, you should always bet or 2 bet. If they 3 bet, then just call, because they do have it. For the difference in rake, you have to be right only 10% of the time or so. There are plenty of occasions where you check/check on 7th and your low w/2pr beats a high only hand that never made it. |
Time to make an adjustment to my game. (which is why I posted the hand) |
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nimbus
Message Board Junkie
Joined: 23 Feb 2007
Posts: 1175
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| Posted: Sun Apr 27, 2008 9:21 pm Post subject: |
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Here are my thoughts
3rd
call
4th
call - I like your play here. So people might cap at this point since they are up and down and are the only low draw but calling disguises the strength of your hand.
5th
I think a raise here is far superior to calling. You want to up against one caller since you have a made high and low hand. You don't want villian2 to get a cheap draw to his flush or fluke a straight. Plus villian2 has shown so much interest on 4th that he might just go ahead and call 2 cold anyway. All of the outcomes for your raise can only be good.
If you only had a made low then calling is better.
6th
See 5th street comments above. Plus pot is large enough now.
7th
calling is really bad. You can't lose. Sure you might chop but so what. By not raising, you missed the "potential" for another big bet.
Another aspect of raising here is that you are "training" your opponents the consequences of betting into you when you are drawing low. I always raise the river whenever I can't lose. This starts to build fear and respect. Plus they'll start paying off more guessing if you have a high with your low.
Do that enough times and they will start checking their 2 pairs and pairs to you on the river. Thus giving you a free showdown when you just have aces or two small pair and no low. |
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