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Paprika · Full House Joined: 09 Feb 2006 Posts: 194

Played some more Live $2-4 LHE last night with my partner at a local casino. It was her very first time playing any live poker at all and she hung in really well. We practiced a bunch beforehand with cards and chips etc, and I told her that she could expect people at this level to play any 2 cards, there would more than likely be 6-9 players in on every flop and a lot will call bets all the way down with sometimes barely anything at all. I told her to stick to hands like any pairs, 2 good high cards, higher suited connectors etc. and if they didn't hit her on the flop to check and fold in most cases. I didn't want her to get too fancy on her first time. I watched her play and she was easily better than half the table already. She is a quick study(not my credit too much). She really could not believe some of the garbage hands that were shown down. She won a few big pots early and hung in pretty well. She ended up losing a bit overall but she did well for her first time out with a really loose table. My table was even worse. There was one younger girl at the table who was consistenly winning huge pots on rivers with hands like 58 suited that would river a flush with one of her 2 cards. Happened more than one time for her. A typical hand for me last night was I had QQ in LP, raised it PF, 6 callers, flop comes 223, I bet, one caller, turn a K, river a blank, the guy showed KTo and takes it down. I know I didn't hit the flop, but he didn't either and even if he had paired his K there on the flop it prob wouldnt have occured to him that I may have a better K or AA etc? Just doesn't happen LLHE. Whre there is a faint light on they will follow it all the time. The lone big pot I won was with 79s on the button, everyone in, I called with good odds, end up making 9's full but I was almost embarrassed to show my 79! I ended up losing as well a bit. i just got SSHE and am going to dig into it because I think that I need to change my game up and not be so predictable all the time.

Low limit can be very frustrating for sure. The good thing is that the pots are often pretty good in size. I have even opened up my starting hands a lot and am not putting too much faith in Top Pair with a lot of people in the pot. Just won't usually win in Limit. Makes me wonder sometimes if it is really worth it raising PF with big pairs when you know that 8 will see the flop. My gut tells me to still raise those premium pairs and cards PF. I played some $3-6 this morning as well and the play at this room was a lot tighter and a lot less chasing. I know the $2-4 game is really beatable but it appears that it must be done with big draw hands and I am going to have to see a lot more flops I guess. Any comments and tips would be great. Esp. From Griffin. You seem to have a good grasp on the game.

bigwheell · Posted: Tue Oct 31, 2006 3:38 am Post subject:

You are on the right track when you mention that you need to start playing more drawing hands to get the money at low limit holdem at the casinos...

Top pair hands that do not improve to trips do not win enough at showdown to make money with them, when 5+ people are seeing the flop every hand.

Open up you hand selection and try playing more connectors as well as more flush hands and see how things go. Play your pocket pair and you should usually plan on dumping them if they do not become trips.

Variance will be greater as you are seeing more flops that will not connect as often, but you can usually expect bigger pots and less suckouts when playing hands other than top pair hands and going to the river with them.

Keep us posted on your progress...and hope the advice helps.

Paprika · Full House Joined: 09 Feb 2006 Posts: 194

I just opened up SSHE last night. Haven't got that far yet but am looking forward to it. I will keep y'all up to date on my progress both live & on line as far LHE goes cause I know that this game level is beatable.

Read a short bit by Caro regarding people who complaining about low limit HE is bad because of all the chasing and loose bad play but he had a few great points:
1.Without all that bad play the pots would not get large.
2.The pots have to be large in order to overcome the rake and tipping as well.

His points make a lot of sense and I guess I should not be too upset with all the bad play. In the 3-6 game I played at the same plave a lot of the pots were smaller than the 2-4 game=Better players and less in on the flops. I think that one does have to have patience and know that you are going to have some major suckouts in Limit compared to NLHE. I only saw one PF raised hand stand up the other night and it was a guy next to me who was one of the better players at the table. He had AKo, raid PF and paired his Ace on the flop and took down the pot. It wasn't that big of a pot though. 2 others paired their ace as well with really low kickers and called him all the way down. This figures. Funny, but up to just not too long ago, I have been playing all my HE games the same-Tight agg but you can't play LLHE that way. I still can not get over just how many are seeing every flop though at 2-4. I haven't played 1-2 but I'll just assume that it is the same as 2-4. 3-6 there were still a few chasers but overall a lot better players.

bigwheell · Posted: Tue Oct 31, 2006 4:23 pm Post subject:

The super system is written for mid level players and many of the theorys and concepts explained in that book will not work well at 2/4 tables. I thought you ment the super system when you mentioned sshe...I see now that you meant Small stakes hold em.
Small Stakes Hold 'em: Winning Big With Expert Play (Paperback)
by Ed Miller, David Sklansky, Mason Malmuth....

This should be the bible of a small stakes poker player...It does an excellent job of explaining the thought process and ideas on why bad players make poor plays and bad decisions and the best way to capitalize on their mistakes.

Paprika · Full House Joined: 09 Feb 2006 Posts: 194

I just last night started in reading that book. So far it is great and I have read a few things that make very good sense.

griffinlord · Posted: Tue Oct 31, 2006 9:45 pm Post subject:

bigwheell · Posted: Tue Oct 31, 2006 11:53 pm Post subject:

One comforting thought is that when getting sucked out on alot(almost sounds like sexy talk) is that you putting your chips in the middle with the best hand most of the time.

Paprika · Full House Joined: 09 Feb 2006 Posts: 194

Was able to play agian today live at the 2-4 at a different location than normal(it was in between work stops!!) Played for 2 hours and this was the very first time that a 2-4 table was not all loosey goosey. I played more starting hands than normal but tried to keep position in mind more than just playing them cause I wanted to play them. It is getting to the point that I can pretty much read all the players stlyes and a few tells at this level now. I worked very hard at trying to put people on hands when I wasn't in the pot and was actually right on a few times. Also a few times I was way off to be truthful. Every hand that took to showdon won, about 5 pots. Won a few pots just betting the flop after a raise with only a few callers. Funny, but there weren't huge family pots that I have grown so accustomed to seeing in 2-4 in today's game. A lot of times it was 3 to the flop instead of the usual 8! That=smaller pots for sure. It was fun and I feel like I am getting better at my limit game overall.

All your tips are starting to sink in. Muchas gracias to y'all!

bigwheell · Posted: Wed Nov 01, 2006 8:46 pm Post subject:

The difference in games is probably the time of day.

Old timers and others just passing the time of day when you played today during the day...
Maniac that want to throw chips around and other willing to gamble and bet it up in the evenings...

I notice a big difference in the quality of players based on the time of day and days of the week even on full tilt.

I enjoy the updates...keep em coming.

I live to far away from the Casinos, and I only make it to them about once a month...So it is good to see how the live game action is going for others.

Paprika · Full House Joined: 09 Feb 2006 Posts: 194

Good point cause come to think of it, most of the players were older non- aggressive types for the most part, happy to call bets and not raise too much. I was one of the younger ones at the table! Still each session is a great learning experience. I can always find mistakes in some plays that I do and that others do as well. I still contend that one of the biggest mistakes that players make in any poker game is not having enough chipsi n front of them. Example: One guy bought in for $50, played for about 45 minutes got down to about $10 in chips, (played a few too many hands and made some bad calls). He finally hit a King high flush but had all of his $10 in the pot with 3 others. He should have won a big pot but he only won a medium main pot. Several hands hands later, he hits a boat with a lot of people in the, same results, had all his chips in by the flop , won the main but he should have won it all(side pot was just a big as the main I think or close to it). Anyways, the point of this-It's okay to sit down with a set amount but have some extra cash on you to buy more chips (if you plan on being a good [b]player that is)always have enough in case you need to cap the streets. It happened in one pot today that each street got capped by 2 guys. Broke one of the guys stacks completely. I have a friend that only brings $40 with him to play at 2-4 and it is just not enough for a full session. I'll buy in for $50 or more but keep a close eye on my stack and rebuy to keep it up to enough chips to bet and call raises with. I keep an accurate total of how much chips have bought.

AllInDrawinDead · Posted: Sat Nov 04, 2006 9:34 pm Post subject:

I always like to have a lot of money in front of me. I usually buy in for 20-30 big bets in limit hold em.

I could never get my partner to play poker with me. She was afraid that she wouldn't know what she's doing and lose all her money. Most of the players in these games have no idea what they're doing and if you have even a vague idea of poker strategy you'll do pretty well.

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