| Author |
Message |
diabolic
High Card
Joined: 01 Aug 2006
Posts: 10
|
 Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 12:23 pm Post subject: why neteller may continue business in the U.S. |
 |
|
| I wish that this bill will not affect our ability to play online poker just as much as the next guy. I realize that Neteller is a European-based company. As a Firepay customer, I realize Firepay will soon stop taking transactions for online gambling. Since it is still unclear that the affects of this bill will be, perhaps U.S. banks will not be able to business with Neteller in the future. Don't put it past our government to not let banks do business with this type of organization... These organizations have 270 or something days to operate until the stipulations of the law are in effect, correct? Well, as a business student, I see Neteller keeping operations here until it is clear if they may or may not to squeeze out the last few dollars they can out of this industry. In fact, I'm sure their profits have skyrocketed since Firepay is quitting, which is maybe why they choose to stand until they may be forced to leave. They could just be putting up a front until they have to pull out, if that will be the case. I truly wish this is not the case, but you can't take press releases for truth, really. Lets hope this isn't the way it is, but just my perspective. "Only believe half of what you read and nothing you hear." |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
BruceStringbean
Pair
Joined: 11 Oct 2006
Posts: 44
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 1:19 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| You are quite correct that we should take a troubled company's initial "press releases" with a grain of salt. If NetTeller is going to be able to continue on with its US business, then will somebody please explain to me why its stock has been "slaughtered", losing nearly two-thirds of its value since the new legislation passed? Do you really believe the shareholders who dumped NetTeller stock could be that naive? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BOYNAMEDSUE
Moderator
Joined: 27 Jun 2005
Posts: 7909
Location: Isle of Tilt
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 1:30 pm Post subject: |
|
|
From what I'm hearing, banks don't really want to have to enforce the act, so they won't unless it's obvious that you're using the transaction to gamble online. Even some politicians have said there is lots of wiggle room for the banks. Not sure what that means, but it sounds good.
Neteller isn't just for online gambling, so they might not block transactions to Neteller. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BOYNAMEDSUE
Moderator
Joined: 27 Jun 2005
Posts: 7909
Location: Isle of Tilt
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 1:37 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| BruceStringbean wrote: |
| You are quite correct that we should take a troubled company's initial "press releases" with a grain of salt. If NetTeller is going to be able to continue on with its US business, then will somebody please explain to me why its stock has been "slaughtered", losing nearly two-thirds of its value since the new legislation passed? Do you really believe the shareholders who dumped NetTeller stock could be that naive? |
All online gaming and online gaming related stock has been slaughtered. C'mon, even you must know that stocks frequently go up or down based on fears and positive expectations alone. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ajnate
Pair
Joined: 05 Dec 2005
Posts: 44
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 2:13 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| Neteller isn't just for online gambling, so they might not block transactions to Neteller. |
That is certainly true, but irrelevant. If they're conducting business with gambling operations, the fact that some (and maybe even most) of their business is coming from other operations is meaningless. Just because a person only embezzles from his employer on Monday, but works perfectly legit on Tuesday thru Friday, doesn't mean the Monday activities will simply be overlooked. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BruceStringbean
Pair
Joined: 11 Oct 2006
Posts: 44
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 2:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Yes, of course, stocks sell off on rumors and fears all the time, a few percentage points. But a huge drop like the one NetTeller has suffered is unlikely to be due to mere nervousness, rumor, or some "what if" scenario. A drop this dramatic nearly always means that the company is in for huge financial trouble. And market forces are a far more reliable barometer of the seriousness of this situation than any desperate comments made by NetTeller exec's at a gaming conference or by online poker touts working for FullTilt. Heck, if you guys are all so sure this is going to play out as business as usual, you are wasting your time playing poker. Buy NetTeller stock instead. You will triple your money in 270 days as the share price rebounds after the gaming legislation proves ineffective. But of course that will never happen. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
UFO1947
Alien Interrogator
Joined: 08 Jun 2006
Posts: 3306
Location: NS, Canada
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 2:52 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| BruceStringbean wrote: |
| Yes, of course, stocks sell off on rumors and fears all the time, a few percentage points. But a huge drop like the one NetTeller has suffered is unlikely to be due to mere nervousness, rumor, or some "what if" scenario. A drop this dramatic nearly always means that the company is in for huge financial trouble. And market forces are a far more reliable barometer of the seriousness of this situation than any desperate comments made by NetTeller exec's at a gaming conference or by online poker touts working for FullTilt. Heck, if you guys are all so sure this is going to play out as business as usual, you are wasting your time playing poker. Buy NetTeller stock instead. You will triple your money in 270 days as the share price rebounds after the gaming legislation proves ineffective. But of course that will never happen. |
you have to be the most negative person I have ever encountered.
Last edited by UFO1947 on Fri Oct 13, 2006 9:35 am; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
illustriousday
High Card
Joined: 15 Nov 2005
Posts: 5
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 9:58 pm Post subject: |
|
|
I read somewhere on this site that neteller is already banned in Maryland.
So if u live there you can't use a maryland bank to deposit funds into a Neteller account. I'm not sure if the U.S. can institute a Federal ban on banks depositing into netller accounts. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
TedyKGB17
Message Board Junkie
Joined: 19 Apr 2006
Posts: 1565
Location: Indianapolis
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 10:14 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ajnate wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Neteller isn't just for online gambling, so they might not block transactions to Neteller. |
That is certainly true, but irrelevant. If they're conducting business with gambling operations, the fact that some (and maybe even most) of their business is coming from other operations is meaningless. Just because a person only embezzles from his employer on Monday, but works perfectly legit on Tuesday thru Friday, doesn't mean the Monday activities will simply be overlooked. |
come on?!?!?!?! are u serious? that is the worst comparison i have ever heard. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Kloaked Spirit
Royal Flush
Joined: 03 Nov 2005
Posts: 869
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 10:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| ajnate wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Neteller isn't just for online gambling, so they might not block transactions to Neteller. |
That is certainly true, but irrelevant. If they're conducting business with gambling operations, the fact that some (and maybe even most) of their business is coming from other operations is meaningless. Just because a person only embezzles from his employer on Monday, but works perfectly legit on Tuesday thru Friday, doesn't mean the Monday activities will simply be overlooked. |
I withdraw money from a bank to go buy drugs on Monday. I withdraw money to buy normal things every other day of the week. Because of the fact that I can buy drugs with the money that is mine and given by the bank, all banks must stop giving back cash to the people it belongs to. We need to stop the possibility of potential illegal business you know. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
TedyKGB17
Message Board Junkie
Joined: 19 Apr 2006
Posts: 1565
Location: Indianapolis
|
| Posted: Thu Oct 12, 2006 10:24 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Kloaked Spirit wrote: |
| ajnate wrote: |
| Quote: |
| Neteller isn't just for online gambling, so they might not block transactions to Neteller. |
That is certainly true, but irrelevant. If they're conducting business with gambling operations, the fact that some (and maybe even most) of their business is coming from other operations is meaningless. Just because a person only embezzles from his employer on Monday, but works perfectly legit on Tuesday thru Friday, doesn't mean the Monday activities will simply be overlooked. |
I withdraw money from a bank to go buy drugs on Monday. I withdraw money to buy normal things every other day of the week. Because of the fact that I can buy drugs with the money that is mine and given by the bank, all banks must stop giving back cash to the people it belongs to. We need to stop the possibility of potential illegal business you know. |
what kind of drugs did u get?
what are u doing later?
want 2 be friends? |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ajnate
Pair
Joined: 05 Dec 2005
Posts: 44
|
| Posted: Fri Oct 13, 2006 11:13 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| come on?!?!?!?! are u serious? that is the worst comparison i have ever heard. |
I'm sorry you didn't like my analogy. But, unfortunately there is no reason for the US govt to allow US Banks to continue to do business with Neteller as long as they continue to allow Americans to do business with companies that are under no uncertain terms illegal (ie sportsbooks). The fact that some of the business that Neteller does is perfectly legit is completely irrelevant.
This bill spells that out pretty clearly, I thought. Even though you can argue that online poker is legal, there's no getting around the fact that sportsbooks are not. Neteller allows us to put money into sportsbooks. I'm sorry you don't see it that way. But, I don't see any other way to see it.
Maybe we get lucky. Maybe Neteller gets ignored in all of this. But I really can't see how. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ajnate
Pair
Joined: 05 Dec 2005
Posts: 44
|
| Posted: Fri Oct 13, 2006 11:23 am Post subject: |
|
|
| Quote: |
| I withdraw money from a bank to go buy drugs on Monday. I withdraw money to buy normal things every other day of the week. Because of the fact that I can buy drugs with the money that is mine and given by the bank, all banks must stop giving back cash to the people it belongs to. We need to stop the possibility of potential illegal business you know. |
Actually if they know you're buying drugs, they can certainly seize all of your money. They never would, if you were just using. But, they do all the time for alleged distributors. In this analogy -- and a much worse analogy than mine, Neteller would be the distributor.
I can't believe some of the naivete on this subject. Do you actually believe that the US govt can't tell US banks to stop doing business with Neteller? Do you actually believe that this UIGE Act doesn't give them the necessary tools to do so? You'd have a stronger argument if Neteller wasn't allowing Americans to pump money into sportsbooks, but only allowing other gaming where the Wire Act of 1961 is much more vague at best, and probably doesn't apply at all. Since that isn't currently the case, I don't know how you can even begin to dispute what I'm saying.
It can happen. And I'd say it would take about a 5-out suckout on the river to avoid it happening. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mcmichael51
High Card
Joined: 13 Oct 2006
Posts: 1
|
| Posted: Fri Oct 13, 2006 3:23 pm Post subject: |
|
|
| Can't you just write and mail a check directly? If not, certainly you can cash out by having them mail you a check. Banks won't refuse a check from a gaming company if it just says XYZ corp like they always do. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ajnate
Pair
Joined: 05 Dec 2005
Posts: 44
|
| Posted: Sat Oct 14, 2006 10:56 am Post subject: |
|
|
| mcmichael51 wrote: |
| Can't you just write and mail a check directly? If not, certainly you can cash out by having them mail you a check. Banks won't refuse a check from a gaming company if it just says XYZ corp like they always do. |
I think that's a possibility. However, I don't think that alleviates my biggest concern... a large number of mediocre to bad players will go away - or play much less frequently. It just makes it more annoying and time consuming to get money in and remove money. This will be enough to remove many of the people that don't REALLY want to play.
When it comes down to it, the people that really want to play will probably still find a way to play -- Western Union or whatever -- assuming the govt doesn't ban the sites from ISPs (which would be very difficult for them to do). It just becomes much more difficult to profit off of serious players, than the current crop of casual (ie. bad) players. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
FAQ
Search
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
