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drewg22
Full House
Joined: 25 May 2008
Posts: 234
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 Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 9:28 am Post subject: |
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| nekotec wrote: |
| i dont like this decision either but i guess its fair cause some players have no idea about this sites. It does give an advantage (very small one) but it is an advantage. I hope they revoke this decision but i cant be too mad with full tilt for doing this. |
What advantage does it give?
Even if you know a player has a bad ROI or does not finish ITM much, how does that help you?
Until you actually see what they do at the table you don't know why they are a losing player. They could be too tight and allow themselves to get blinded out. They could be too loose and play too many poor hole cards. They could be a calling station. They could be too agressive post flop with middle pairs. They may not know how to bet to deny odds. They may chase flushes and straights without proper odds.
You won't know any of this until you actually observe their play. |
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CheezWeezil
High Card
Joined: 19 Jun 2009
Posts: 6
Location: Chasing two year old twins round the house
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| Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 9:33 am Post subject: |
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| I like most of you am against this ban on OPR. I find that FullTilt needs to realize that our trust in them is their most valuable asset. If they lose our trust they lose our participation and our money. OPR in almost all of our opinions is NOT an advantage over other players, but a tool we use to track our own stats. Even the mere mention of COLLUSION between FullTilt and the other stat trackers ,that are still allowed, should be a wake up call that we have opinions ,and we expect them to respect our wishes. We respect their rules and we appreciate their effort to protect us. But don't treat us like children. We want OPR. Are you going to listen to us or even better can you fill the role of OPR for us. WE WANT OUR RANKINGS AND STATS! |
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CheezWeezil
High Card
Joined: 19 Jun 2009
Posts: 6
Location: Chasing two year old twins round the house
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| Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 9:37 am Post subject: |
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OH and BTW. I am glad some of you mentioned the poll i posted. I would have been VERY VERY VERY SUPER MEGA interested to see the results too.
I posted it in the feedback section because it seemed to me to be a feedback question. Glad it lasted about 60 seconds. Thanks alot boomer |
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TheFlashOne
Banned
Joined: 25 Aug 2008
Posts: 341
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| Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 11:26 am Post subject: |
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Ok then
Apart from OPR, Sharkscope and thepokerdb - where else can I track my SNG's and MTT's?? |
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UFO1947
Take me2 ur Chip Leader
Joined: 08 Jun 2006
Posts: 5324
Location: NS, Canada
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| Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 12:46 pm Post subject: |
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| Excel, PT3, Holdem manager? |
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gramaan
High Card
Joined: 10 Apr 2008
Posts: 6
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| Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 2:10 pm Post subject: |
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Like others, I use OPR to track my own stats.
I stopped my own recordkeeping when I found OPR had summaries I was looking for, much more than I was tracking on my own.
At the very least, FTP should give us comparable summaries if they block OPR.
FTP can compile their own summaries or link to OPR and let players retrieve their OPR summaries through FTP. We deserve to see our own stats.
Better yet, take the easy way out and just let OPR show FTP data.
As far as "unfair advantage", any such thing, if it indeed exists, I would say is more than compensated by the dynamic nature of the card decks.
I could probably prove it but I don't have the mastery of voodoo mathematics to process voodoo datum. |
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MoneyPedator
High Card
Joined: 31 Mar 2009
Posts: 5
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| Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 4:52 pm Post subject: |
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bad decision!!!!
i have been playing here almost everyday. you are just about lose another loyal customer, tilt. |
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flob73
High Card
Joined: 06 Jan 2009
Posts: 6
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| Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 5:39 pm Post subject: |
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| i can tell you a site that still tracks FT p.m me if you want the address |
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smoking ash
Two Pair
Joined: 06 Oct 2008
Posts: 59
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| Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 6:14 pm Post subject: |
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I dont track my own stats and dont have the energy to do all the breakdowns that opr does. I see no advantage of using this site other then to track your tourny progress/profits etc. If someone is shown there as a winner that doesnt tell me how etc. Just tells me he cashes more then not.
So they allow some tracking tools that track your hands etc but deny a site from tracking your win percentage...HMMM
What they need to do is get rid of all the bots on the site...but then again they would lose a good portion of their player pool if they did that.
AND
they should practice truth in advertising. When is a pro going to sit with the low stackers or even at their own tables..... |
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WeedFarm
High Card
Joined: 08 May 2009
Posts: 14
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| Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 6:32 pm Post subject: |
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| They only banned OPR because it is free. FTP is probably affiliated with SharkScope and they make a ton of money. So theyre eliminating the competition. |
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nekotec
I Hate Min-Raises
Joined: 24 Nov 2007
Posts: 1314
Location: Mexico
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| Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 7:00 pm Post subject: |
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| drewg22 wrote: |
| nekotec wrote: |
| i dont like this decision either but i guess its fair cause some players have no idea about this sites. It does give an advantage (very small one) but it is an advantage. I hope they revoke this decision but i cant be too mad with full tilt for doing this. |
What advantage does it give?
Even if you know a player has a bad ROI or does not finish ITM much, how does that help you?
Until you actually see what they do at the table you don't know why they are a losing player. They could be too tight and allow themselves to get blinded out. They could be too loose and play too many poor hole cards. They could be a calling station. They could be too agressive post flop with middle pairs. They may not know how to bet to deny odds. They may chase flushes and straights without proper odds.
You won't know any of this until you actually observe their play. |
any data that is non-fulltilt based is considered an advantage. Full tilt has no reason to inform its poker players about this sites. So it does makes an unfair advantage.
you can argue all u want, but if it doesnt make a difference why are u whining so much about this decision? Its gotta be something good for u to argue so much.
i can say that i have used opr stats on certain players, i may laydown a marginal hand to a player that has shown good profits or good stats
plus, if i add opr data with player tendencies in about 15 hands from start, i can make a clear image on how this player plays |
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pennstatejake
High Card
Joined: 05 Apr 2008
Posts: 4
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| Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 9:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Full Tilt could send out an email informing every player that they are listed on this website and how to take themselves off if they feel they are being negatively affected by OPR. I have a bit of a law background and I believe that legally Full Tilt cannot prevent OPR from using these statistics. I think that both sides are aware of this too. If you are interested look up the case CBC v. Major League Baseball Media. The case basically says that CBC was able to use MLB statistics for its fantasy baseball league without paying MLB or the players association. This is very similar because they are both publicly available and attainable information and they sets of data are simply grouped. So legally I think OPR can do what they want without FT's cooperation. Additionally, I think that OPR should continue to provide their service despite FT's demands to pull the content down. There are so many suggestions I could make that would be better than the actions FT has taken. Please complain to them at support@fulltiltpoker.com |
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drewg22
Full House
Joined: 25 May 2008
Posts: 234
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| Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 10:32 pm Post subject: |
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| nekotec wrote: |
| drewg22 wrote: |
| nekotec wrote: |
| i dont like this decision either but i guess its fair cause some players have no idea about this sites. It does give an advantage (very small one) but it is an advantage. I hope they revoke this decision but i cant be too mad with full tilt for doing this. |
What advantage does it give?
Even if you know a player has a bad ROI or does not finish ITM much, how does that help you?
Until you actually see what they do at the table you don't know why they are a losing player. They could be too tight and allow themselves to get blinded out. They could be too loose and play too many poor hole cards. They could be a calling station. They could be too agressive post flop with middle pairs. They may not know how to bet to deny odds. They may chase flushes and straights without proper odds.
You won't know any of this until you actually observe their play. |
any data that is non-fulltilt based is considered an advantage. Full tilt has no reason to inform its poker players about this sites. So it does makes an unfair advantage.
you can argue all u want, but if it doesnt make a difference why are u whining so much about this decision? Its gotta be something good for u to argue so much.
i can say that i have used opr stats on certain players, i may laydown a marginal hand to a player that has shown good profits or good stats
plus, if i add opr data with player tendencies in about 15 hands from start, i can make a clear image on how this player plays |
I am complaining about it for a few reasons:
1) It is an excellent source to track my own stats and has great funtionality to sort by various games and buy ins.
2) OPR should not be singled out and Sharkscope and other sites allowed to give the same/similar data EXCEPT players have to pay for it. Let's call a spade, a spade, FTP doesn't give one lick about the supposed "unfair advantage". That is a smokescreen for some other reason.
Finally, I think it is pretty foolish to base my play against someone on OPR stats and 15 hands. |
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TheFlashOne
Banned
Joined: 25 Aug 2008
Posts: 341
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| Posted: Sat Jun 20, 2009 11:28 pm Post subject: |
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I dont care if they shut it down - but have something comparable within FT that can track your OWN progress...
99% of people angry about this is because it means they cant track THEIR OWN stats (ie nothing to do with using data to make reads etc)
This is the issue here. |
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SmellsLikeDonk
Royal Flush
Joined: 12 Jan 2009
Posts: 598
Location: Shoving where it's +EV
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| Posted: Sun Jun 21, 2009 12:11 am Post subject: |
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| I'm really curious if Full Tilt did something to prevent OPR from mining, or if OPR voluntarily did this. I really think OPR voluntarily pulled the info (and the question becomes why) because there's no easy way FT can prevent mining (e.g. pokertableratings, sharkscope, etc. are still live). |
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