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dodge these
Message Board Junkie
Joined: 21 Jun 2006
Posts: 1008
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 Posted: Tue Oct 06, 2009 5:54 am Post subject: Another Interesting Hand... That Didn't Happen |
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Villain is same tag player from an interesting hand I just posted.
Full Tilt Poker $1/$2 Pot Limit Omaha Hi $0.30 Ante - 6 players -
The Official Hand History
UTG: $420.35
MP: $260.35
Hero (CO): $910.45
BTN: $242.60
SB: $1198.85
BB: $263.50
Pre Flop: ($4.80) Hero is CO with Q  J  9 Q 
1 fold, MP calls $2, Hero raises to $10.80, 1 fold, SB raises to $38.20, 2 folds, Hero calls $27.40
Flop: ($82.20) 7 8 8 (2 players)
SB requests TIME, SB bets $58, Hero calls $58
Turn: ($198.20) Q (2 players)
SB requests TIME, SB checks, Hero checks
River: ($198.20) 9 (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $99.10, SB requests TIME...
I think my PF call is fine given how deep we are. Flop call is floting thinking that I can take it way almost every time unless he actually hit an 8. He might be getting frisky given how deep we are but I think that is very unlikely from him esp being oop. Now I hit the perfect card on turn. At this point I hope he has and 8, but decided to check back because as I said I think he woudl likely fold there if I were to bet a blank turn such as the Q appears to be.
Now I obviously have to bet once he checks to me. OTR it may be more likley I am trying to steal, but that card also completed a wrap draw if that is what I had on flop. What should be my bet sizing here, and what can I expect to get paid off by? I expect a str8 will pay there and maybe trip 8's, as will any other boat obviously, but will AQ or overpair?
But my real question is what if he reraises? My image is such that I would bet the str8 there on the river, but probably would not pay off unless I had a boat of my own. This should take away the value from reraising anything but third nuts or better (not counting quads). That should actually incease the value in bluffing there, but then again he's not durrrr so I don't expect he'd ever bluff here, so if he is great 4 him (or me  ).
That leaves 99 (highly unlikely) and maybe Q8xx are the only hands he can possibly think he can get some value out of me with if I have 8's full. But really, given stack sizes, is he ever doing that with anything but quads this deep? Like I said he is a firaly tight thinking player, but has not been involved in any big pots that the fish was not part of thus far. So if he repots after he times, do I insta call, puke call, or even consider folding? |
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francois8
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Joined: 10 Jun 2008
Posts: 1931
Location: Conshohocken, PA
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| Posted: Tue Oct 06, 2009 10:23 am Post subject: |
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I at least insta call if he raises, I may even repot... if he has 88, good for him. I don't play at these stakes though, but I don't fold nut boats worrying about quads, if that happens I pay it off, folding has to be -EV. Lesser boats are tougher of course, but you didn't play this hand like you had QQ.
I can't think of a reason not to bet the turn though. If he has an 8 let him make a big mistake, that queen doesn't hit anything except QQ which of course you have. If he's got AAxx or KKxx, let him think that you either floated him on flop or maybe have some kind of wrap and are trying the stop and go. If he has some sort of big pair hand, nearly any river card is going to shut him down, especially that 9 there. |
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dodge these
Message Board Junkie
Joined: 21 Jun 2006
Posts: 1008
Location: undisclosed
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| Posted: Tue Oct 06, 2009 2:35 pm Post subject: |
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| francois8 wrote: |
I at least insta call if he raises, I may even repot... if he has 88, good for him. I don't play at these stakes though, but I don't fold nut boats worrying about quads, if that happens I pay it off, folding has to be -EV. Lesser boats are tougher of course, but you didn't play this hand like you had QQ.
I can't think of a reason not to bet the turn though. If he has an 8 let him make a big mistake, that queen doesn't hit anything except QQ which of course you have. If he's got AAxx or KKxx, let him think that you either floated him on flop or maybe have some kind of wrap and are trying the stop and go. If he has some sort of big pair hand, nearly any river card is going to shut him down, especially that 9 there. |
Sure you play these stakes. It's only 1/2 and to tell the truth it seems fishier (at least laggier) that .5/1, and just as easy to beat, though I usualy look 4 the more jucy games to take a shot as I am only properly rolled for 100plo. This was the bale with the super fish from the other 2 hands but he just busted and left me and this guy with most his $$.
As far as ctual hand, insta call or repoting were basically same in my mind as I think I only had like 100 left behind if he pots it, so I didn;t bother writing in that distinction. As far as not betting the turn, like I said, I floted teh flop because I think he is the only other good player, but a fairly cautios guy (not scared as I saw him make a coupel of marginal calldowns) that would have folded to a similar sized bet ott if he did not have the 8. I think I can very reasonably represent hitting that flop with a good wrap hand given my actions so far, and I realy don't think he'd make a play on me nor call trying to catch a 2 outter.
But that's why I posted this hand because I'm not sure how correct my assumptions about that are. He was basically a typical tag player, and perhaps they would call dow that turn with overs... and if he does what should I have done if insted the next card was <Q? Do I fire another bullet otr (assuming no A or K either)? what if instead I hit the str8? Do I still bet like this and risk runnign into a boat, or check behind? |
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francois8
Message Board Junkie
Joined: 10 Jun 2008
Posts: 1931
Location: Conshohocken, PA
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| Posted: Tue Oct 06, 2009 4:35 pm Post subject: |
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| dodge these wrote: |
Sure you play these stakes. It's only 1/2 and to tell the truth it seems fishier (at least laggier) that .5/1, and just as easy to beat, though I usualy look 4 the more jucy games to take a shot as I am only properly rolled for 100plo. This was the bale with the super fish from the other 2 hands but he just busted and left me and this guy with most his $$.
As far as ctual hand, insta call or repoting were basically same in my mind as I think I only had like 100 left behind if he pots it, so I didn;t bother writing in that distinction. As far as not betting the turn, like I said, I floted teh flop because I think he is the only other good player, but a fairly cautios guy (not scared as I saw him make a coupel of marginal calldowns) that would have folded to a similar sized bet ott if he did not have the 8. I think I can very reasonably represent hitting that flop with a good wrap hand given my actions so far, and I realy don't think he'd make a play on me nor call trying to catch a 2 outter.
But that's why I posted this hand because I'm not sure how correct my assumptions about that are. He was basically a typical tag player, and perhaps they would call dow that turn with overs... and if he does what should I have done if insted the next card was <Q? Do I fire another bullet otr (assuming no A or K either)? what if instead I hit the str8? Do I still bet like this and risk runnign into a boat, or check behind? |
Wow, those are some deep stacks for 1/2... Yea, I've played those. Usually don't sit this deep though, most often play cap when I play 1/2 cause I don't want to have an extra swing to the crazy swingy sessions which are PLO (haven't played with antes either).
Honestly I bet the turn because you're almost certainly ahead; with the added benefit of he may think you're playing a wrap and trying to control the pot. If he has an overpair he may raise to see where he's at then you can choose your course of action.
On river, I'm never folding to that card. If I bet turn, I hope that river is low so I can bet again and he's only worried about an 8 and not about the wrap draw getting home as well. |
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